DagnyJ

Fri, Sep 25, 2009 : 8 a.m.

The idea that the city council would waste its time with this now is clear evidence that they have their priorities wrong. The state is in economic turmoil. Bridge and roads are crumbling. The city is laying off cops. But hey...let's focus on the menace of plastic shopping bags! These guys all need to be voted out of office. Rapundalo...you need to shoot this down completely, not call for more study.

jcj

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 2:30 p.m.

As for the bags blowing around. It is not the bags fault it it the fault of the brain dead people that live like hogs! My wife and I are constantly picking up someone else's trash on our street. It all depends who's bull is getting gored as to anyone's thoughts on any subject.

jcj

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 2:22 p.m.

I would like to see some effort put into the noise pollution I have to put up with everyday with all the dogs barking. But that won't happen because just about every tree hugging LIBERAL in town has 3 of them! I don't put much stock in what a moose says.

Moose

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 10:27 a.m.

Anyone using the term liberal as a derogatory label completely removes all credibility to their post.

Paul

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 8:26 a.m.

This is the silly stuff that keeps the city from progress. In the old days, people whined about paper bags, so stores began giving away plastic bags. Now, it's plastic bags, so paper are available again. The same with bottled water. Are we going to change the name of the plastic bags and bottled water to make people feel better, like the "holiday trees" and other such nonsense? The quick fixes the liberals espouse are no better for the environment than the original issue. Banning plastic is superficial. How about the City Council concern themselves with public safety and infrastructure improvements?

treetowncartel

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 6:54 a.m.

Put a 1 cent deposit on them satewide, people will pick them up everywhere then. The bottle deposit law did wonders for the state, too bad it doesn't apply to more containers.

a2grateful

Wed, Sep 23, 2009 : 4:22 a.m.

Personally, I use reusable bags. They hold more and don't break.... Years ago, Sam's Club offered no bags. They had used shipping boxes at aisle end if one needed a grocery carrier.... Kroger has a plastic bag recycling program. On Maple Road, for example, there are large bins inside the airlock foyer, dedicated to plastic bag recycling. Recycling practice ends landfill argument.... Curious: what do plastic bag haters use for trash bags in their homes? Do you realize that many people actually buy plastic bags to hold trash for disposal in landfills? What do you suggest as a replacement for these? Final question.... Some questions for scientists: What percentage of overall landfill volume is devoted to plastic bags? Are the landfills really overflowing with plastic bags?... Finally, aren't some plastic bags are now made with cornstarch to facilitate decomposition?... Let's see: recyclable, biodegradable... What is the true issue? Is it another example of "herd micromanagement" by self-righteous "visionaries"?

Hactin

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 8:02 p.m.

This will help reduce the number of plastic bags I see blowing around and stuck in shrubs and fences. Nevermind the naysayers. They opposed the 10 cent bottle deposit too.

Moose

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 6:23 p.m.

We shouldn't be surprised at how many people will continue to ignore the facts, common wisdom and the general direction of sustainability just to prove how independent they are. No one is "aligning" with San Francisco. We're just trying to save our planet from the head in the sand crowd. Well, no one is independent. We are all dependent on each other and our environment. I prefer that people not defecate where I live.

jcj

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 5:17 p.m.

Great! The last thing I want to do is align myself with San Francisco!! I normally use paper however I agree with Taycheedah. The environmentalist are almost always on the wrong side of the argument in the long run. Now there is compelling evidence that global warming is a fallacy and the ones crying the loudest are the ones that stand to get rich off going green. I WILL JUST GO OUT OF TOWN TO SHOP. Not because I prefer plastic but because I resent city council spending so much time on the wrong issues!!

Moose

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 4:58 p.m.

It's not a catch 22 at all. Get some sturdy cloth bag and remember to use it. Pass them down to your kids in your will. How hard is that? I go to stores that sell bulk items and ask them for the 20 & 30 lb bags that bulk foods like dried beans and flour come in and use them for my trash. I use about 5 a month. They hold a lot of trash. Sometimes I find them in the dumpster all boxed up. Sometimes enough bags for a couple of months.

Moose

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 4:47 p.m.

Google search is your friend. http://www.buzzle.com/articles/environmental-pollution-the-harmful-effects-of-plastic-bags.html Yeah, those who do the right thing don't need a law, but sometimes those who refuse to do the right thing need some extra disincentive. Plastic bags are like second hand smoke. It affects everyone. Either with increased health and environmental costs, using diminishing resources, filling up landfills etc. These things affect every single one of us, locally and globally. Why should we all pay for someone else's selfishness?

HBA

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 4:29 p.m.

We presume that the plastic bags that are recyclable--such as those currently in use at Busch's--would be exempt from the ban. Correct? Please remember also that if plastic bags are in fact banished, people will be reverting to paper. Which are more costly/damaging to the environment? It seems to be a catch-22.

notnecessary

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 2:09 p.m.

@Alex Baker - If government did away with every externality, we'd kill everyone that is over 70 years old, those with terminal illnesses, etc. Government's purpose isn't to eliminate each externality we face in society.

Ordinary joe

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 12:45 p.m.

Ok- People have said how much these plastic bags cost the environment in "creating & disposal " costs. Has anyone conducted a study to find out the actual cost to the environment these re-usable bags have when they're manufactured? Maybe I missed something, but do the "earth friendly" re-usable bags actually grow on trees as some people believe?? The bags I see now have a lot of plastic in them, & because of this, is A2 to ban these as well?? Surely the A2 City Council must have something more important to tackle than something like this.

a2grateful

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 12:09 p.m.

Moose: those that "do the right thing" never need a law to prompt their action. Please pass the tea. However, I'm an uncle, not an a(u)nti! Ba da bing! Maybe Council should pass a bad joke ban/ordinance. That would never fly, for they would be banning themselves...; )

Alex Baker

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:56 a.m.

Most of these plastic bags just end up in the trash after they are used. Plastic bag consumption throughout the world has resulted in a huge collections of plastics forming in the Pacific Ocean. In addition, the creation of plastic bags uses a lot of oil and causes greenhouse gas emissions. I think that when we're talking about plastic bags, paper bags need to also be included in the discussion because they are just as bad environmentally. It's not that hard to take reusable bags to the stores. We need to make a nationwide transition to a lower waste lifestyle, and eliminating our plastic bag use is a good start. This needs to happen in Ann Arbor because we need to lead the way for other cities to do the same thing. It's not like Pittsfield Township or Scio Township are going to stop using plastic bags before Ann Arbor does. I'd like to address a couple of points I have seen on this discussion. To those who think that the City Council is wasting time on this, I would like to point out that this is something that would have positive effects for a long lasting time and it is easy to put through, unlike the budget. To the poop scoop contingency, the reason that this is convenient for you is that the plastic bags are free. However, in reality they are not free because of the negative externalities of the creation and disposal of the plastic bags.

Moose

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:43 a.m.

Some people need to dragged into the 21st century. Kicking, screaming and whining all the way. Regardless of any laws, those who refuse to step up and change their unsustainable practices, will be left behind. Those who get with the program now will be far ahead of the game when the oil and chemicals used to make those things become too costly, not only in their price, but their cost to the environment. It's stupid to cut off your nose to spite your face. Those who say that they'd burn more oil and waste more of their time (30 seconds? hah!) just so they can have the "convenience" to use more plastic bags and can't be bothered to carry and remember to use a reusable bag are thinking only of themselves and not about those people who are affected by their selfish decisions. Indeed, they are thumbing their nose at those who do the right thing. We all have to live with what we throw away. It doesn't just disappear once you put it in the trash. Future generations will have to deal with our garbage and waste and it won't be cheap! The "anti"s have a Tea Party mentality.

a2grateful

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:40 a.m.

1) The bags are recyclable for those that use them and then wish to recycle. 2) The bags are reusable for those that wish to reuse them. Trash can liners, etc 3) The ban will likely be unenforceable. For example, there are not enough police officers to enforce existing laws. 4) The ban is all about smoke and mirrors at this point, folks. It's what Ann Arbor City Council does when they run out of energy and ideas to solve true problems... smoke and mirrors!

BCell

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:20 a.m.

No! I need those plastic bags for when I scoop the litter box!

Commoncents

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:15 a.m.

Everyone of us that lives in Ann Arbor: I hope you all realize this is a TAX ON YOU. It also will hurt business as 90% of people will shop where the lowest prices are.... if a business just outside the city has cheaper groceries you can bet that's where everyone will go and the "law" (tax) didn't solve a damn thing... Envinronmentalists have good intentions but they're never the brightest....

aa14

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:06 a.m.

If they do something dumb like say "bring your own bag" I'm just going to drive the extra 30 seconds to shop outside the city rather than carry around a set of bags in my trunk in case I decide to go to the store while I'm out. Geez don't they have more important things to do?

Taycheedah

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 11:04 a.m.

Hmmm let's see. 25 years ago the environmentalists made us switch to plastic because the big bad loggers were going to cut down all the trees and we would run out of oxygen and die. Now they want to ban the very thing that environmentalists forced down our throat for environmental reasons. I'll bet that ice age they told me about in grade school isn't coming either. Wow, environmentalists, is there anything they don't know?

Bpf

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 10:53 a.m.

I'm more concerned with the non-recyclable carry-out containers and A2's policy of not taking a lot of plastic containers. This is a good start, though.

dconkey

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 10:43 a.m.

That's all fine and dandy, but the three Meijer stores, Best Buy, Target and slew of other stores are not within the city limits. To make it really work, it would have to be county wide.

a2grateful

Tue, Sep 22, 2009 : 10:36 a.m.

Yes, Ann Arbor needs to keep pace with the trendy ordinances of San Francisco and Palo Alto.... By its focusing its valuable time on the plastic bag ban, council won't need to concern itself with the City's crumbling bridges, cratered roads, increased neighborhood crime, or astronomical pending budget deficit.... Some plastic bags might avoid the landfill. Quality of life in the City of Ann Arbor should be so fortunate.