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Posted on Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 1:47 p.m.

Nurses union to University of Michigan: 'no cuts' to benefits

By Juliana Keeping

Carrying signs with slogans like “Chop from the top,” and chanting “Nurses united will never be divided,” hundreds of University of Michigan nurses rallied Saturday to show support for a favorable contract for their 4,000-member union.

“We have built the reputation the University of Michigan Health System enjoys and we work hard every day to uphold that reputation,” said Katie Oppenheim, president of the U-M nurses union. “…that’s why patients come here from all over the world.”

The nurses, Oppenheim said, want a “fair contract,” with no cuts to benefits.

The nurses are asking for raises, Oppenheim said at a press conference in early August; but neither the nurses union its employer has provided details on the details of the contract dispute.

The two sides disagree over pensions, health-care benefits, paid time off and other items and haven’t resolved the differences in 37 meetings held since negotiations began in April.

The union and the employer called in a state mediator Thursday who will sit down with the sides Tuesday to try to resolve differences.

Friday, UMHS released a statement that noted Saturday’s picket was not a strike, and that the event wouldn’t impact patient care.

But there was some talk of a strike at the event. The the nurses gave no indication they planned to back down during the negotiations.

"We will win this fight," Oppenheim told the crowd.

A registered nurse from the University of Chicago Medical Center told the crowd about her 1,300-hundred member union’s recent contract battle, which included threats of a strike.

“That’s when the administration started listening,” Dawn Peckler told the crowd, to cheers and applause.

081311-AJC-Registered-Nurse-1.jpg

University of Michigan Registered Nurses Tiziana Berlasty, right, cheers with other nurses at Saturday's rally.

Angela J. Cesere | AnnArbor.com

Nurses, their family members and supporters from numerous unions and activist groups showed up near the medical campus in red to display their support, Oppenheim noted while speaking before the crowd at noon Saturday.

Hundreds of nurses wore shirts that bore the slogan “Nurses make the Michigan difference.”

Supporters who spoke at the event characterized concessions more broadly, as an attack on the middle class by corporate America and a battle between working families and the wealthy few.

Nurses, they say, are among other labor groups who are being asked to do more for less pay.

After about a half hour of speaking, the group marched around the hospital area while chanting support.

Linda Gibb, one of the participants, said that the nurses are key to the health system's revenue, since people go there because of the excellent patient care provided by the nurses.

Michelle Saldana, another attendee, said the health system's benefits make it a draw for nurses at the top of their profession. But Saldana, who commutes an hour to work each day, said "I might look elsewhere" if those benefits are cut.

Juliana Keeping covers general assignment and health and the environment for AnnArbor.com. Reach her at julianakeeping@annarbor.com or 734-623-2528. Follow Juliana Keeping on Twitter

Comments

what is fair

Sun, Aug 21, 2011 : 3:35 p.m.

It is critical in understanding the economic times we are in to also take into perspective the arrogance the top executives have in taking incredible raises, yet still crying we have to cut budgets. They are simply liars. U of M INC as I like to refer to it is making money hand over fist and to the tune of billions of dollars. 2008 - 2010 Ora Pescovitz CEO $700,000(2009) $721,000 Phillip Hanlon, Provost, EVP Acadmics $286,000 $470,000***wow*** Tony Denton ED/CEO UMHHC $387,000 $425,000 Doug Strong CEO UMHHC $546,000 $600,000 Timothy Slottow EVP/ CFO $472,000 $535,000 Patricia A. Warner, MPH ED, C.S. Motts $241,000 $273,000 Margaret Calarco $256,000 $264,000 Notice a nice raise, but not like above** Ph.D. RN, Chief of Nursing Services There are plenty more, and these are public information, you can find them quite easily on Michigan Daily WALK the WALK if your gonna talk the talk!! Greed!! Think about the economic times between 2008 and 2010 and look at how the executives have raped the system and for that matter, the public! Nurses are the point of care, the reason why U of M gets complimented!

Lady Audrey

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 3:35 p.m.

I don't see anything but unreasonable greed here. Why should the nurses pay less for their benefits than the rest of the university faculty and staff? As valuable members of the health care TEAM, they need to get on board and be team players.

Rebecca

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 7:19 p.m.

I think the greed is from the hospital not wanting to pay a professional their value. We are not talking about uneducated employees. We are talking about nationally respected nurses!

Michigan Nurse

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 5:33 a.m.

To ROB: Your comments about insurance being based on tiers is correct. But tell me, do you think it is fair that an RN making $55,000 should be paying the same amount as the person making $500,000? With the current proposal they are TELLING us we must take- this RN insuring her husband and two children will pay 11% of her wages in health care costs. ($6000.00 per year), while the CEO of the hospital, along with many other highly paid management people will have to fork over a whopping 1% of their salary (based on 2 adults and 2 children). If management wants to be FAIR and collect appropriate and EVEN payment for health insurace from all U of M employees, how about charging based on annual income, rather than forcing flat rates on anyone making over $50,000. I know that I do not get to live the life that someone making $250,000 does. My finacial struggles, along with so many other workers in the state of Michigan are there every morning when I wake up. To all you people crying "Deal with it" and "We have to pay, why shouldn't a nurse" I say Why are you angry with the nurses, fighting to keep what we have, FIGHTING to not take concession and be forced to struggle even more?? If you were in this position would you just roll over and say "Well I guess we just have to do this". Would you not FIGHT too? Can you afford to increase your insurance costs by 100%? Our managment is saying "You will take all these concessions (and trust me there are many more than just the health insurance), and we will accept nothing less, and for this, we will give you a 1% raise." Would you roll over like a good dog and make your master happy right after they beat you with a whip? It is time that all of middle America stand together, not roll over and take the abuse! And PLEASE for the record, we are not asking for any raises at ALL. We are asking that our contract remain the same as it was for the last three years when we agreed to take concessions

Lady Audrey

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 3:38 p.m.

I am not angry with nurses ... but your union is making an unreasonable demand in the face of the facts.

Sparty

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 7:22 p.m.

Some of these nurses are just irrational. They think they should be the only UM employees not paying the same rates for medical health care premiums because of factors that are not even related, e.g.: the new hospital building, the wage rates of people in other roles, the profitability or loss in the health system, etc. The fact is, ALL university employees will be paying or moving to the same benefit premium structure based on UM paying a percentage and employees paying a percentage. Most businesses have their plans set this way and even the State model is now set this way. While nurses may have been spoiled in the past, they need to step up and pay their fair share like every other UM employee and most other Americans who see their health care premiums continue to rise. They will keep looking for and continue claiming unfair labor claims as long as they can, but they only continue to look ridiculous in their silly red scrubs. Those that claim they are the ONLY "Michigan Difference" or THEY drive an hour to work, or they comfort the ill they must therefore deserve special treatment are ridiculous. It's their job -- their chosen profession. Every individual who works has to drive to their job, carry out it's assigned duties, and pay for their health care. These nurses show themselves to be out of touch with current economic conditions and really with reality if they think they are entitled to anything. They earn a wage based on economic value and pay benefit premiums based on economic cost factors.

Tracie L.

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 6:32 p.m.

I would like to also point another thing out....the media is fueling the fire that is dividing the working class/middle class people against each other! They say that the UofM nurses on average make 70,000-80,000 a year...but they neglect to tell the public that they are averaging the income of staff nurses with that of CRNAs and nurse practitioners which make over 100,000 per year after master's and doctorate degrees!!! All a ploy to make the public turn on itself and work for less...while making the rich richer...think about it for a minute before you respond to this....

Tracie L.

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 6:31 p.m.

It saddens me when people ask me why our nurses at UofM believe that they deserve to pay less for benefits than everyone else, and why we think we are so special. UofM nurses DO NOT believe that they should pay less than everyone else for benefits....UofM nurses believe that NO ONE should have to pay 30% for their benefits...and if we give in....then everyone, everywhere will end up paying that amount! If nurses give up and just accept the "Pay cut" (because in the end that is what it is), then it will be harder for everyone, Including the "NON-NURSES"...because the next step the University will make is that all of the NON-NURSES will be forced to pay 40% for their health benefits....Someone has to draw the line somewhere!!! Then guess what...EVERYONE (Not just the nurses) will make LESS money, therefore EVERYONE will have LESS money to spend, and then more business and trades will drown....more people will be laid off....more people will be desperate for a job, then more people will be willing to work for less than what they are worth....then less money, less spending, more businesses will crumble! It will just be a vicious cycle! This is a trickle-down economy people!!! We all need to stand up for each other! Just because I may have something someone else does not shouldn't mean I should have it taken away! Instead...the Middle class/working class people should all demand to make what they are worth! If anyone is ignorant enough to think that taking less money from a RICH university because of hard economic times will help everyone else...they need an education on hard improving the economy works.....the only way it is going to get any better for anyone is if we start spending money as a country...and we cannot spend money in a market economy if we are taking "Pay cuts" to make the rich richer! Oh, and by the way....if I take a pay cut, it is not going to make what you pay for health care any cheaper at the hospital!

Michigan Nurse

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 2:15 p.m.

Tonight at 2:00 am what were you doing? Because I was holding my arm around a mother who had just lost her son, while the boy's father could not control his sorrow. This was not my patient, but I needed to be there for the mother. Another nurse helped the father and yet more nurses were there, comforting the entire family. There were 6 nurse on my unit tonight, and 6 nurses cried along with the family and the sorrow that could be felt throughout the unit. Tonight, I will wake up and do it all over again. Our job is not comparable to any other job. Do you know how many different roles we play out in a single shift? We are the compassionate one who consoles. We are the walking pharmacy who ensures that medications are ordered correctly, given on time and safely. We advocate for our patient when the doctors are making decision on your care. We are the data collectors for the medical studies. We are the bookkeepers who document every detail that we have done for our patient. We are a waitress to our patient and the three family members who need to stay at the bedside to comfort their loved one. We are the eyes and ears for your doctor, summing up 12 hours of care in the few minutes they take to decide your care. We clean up if you get sick, and we wash your hair when you can't get out of bed, because we know how much it would mean to you (even though doing so will put us even further behind in our work). If you think you would like to make as much as a nurse does, please, go to college, earn your degree and we will welcome you into our small community where we all know each other, not necessarily by name, but by the genuine respect we can only get from each other, because only a nurse knows what a nurse goes through. "It takes a special person to be a nurse" I have heard that 1000x from my patients. Become a patient.....you will understand. I deserve my salary and I deserve my benefits. Please come and join in and become a nurse. You too will cry our battle

Sciomanone1

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 5:48 a.m.

It is nice that the nurses have a Union that will help them and stand by them, when I worked for the University of Michigan Health Care system for almost 18 years, soon after I told that I had co-workers sleeping during work time on the Midnight shift , I was told I made the Department look bad and I would be fired soon and when I told this to the Union, I was told could I prove it and because I could not they did nothing and soon I was Fired by one of the sleeping workers that became a supervisor and now is called a Manager and she promoted one of her sleeping friends as the supervisor. It is wonderful that the Nurses are all together and have a Union that will help them, When I told the truth about the patient care, I was fired and the sleeping workers are still working and are promoted. NOT one co-worker would work together and help me, they all said that they did not want to be next that this is what happens to many workers when they speak up. I went to the Top Administration on down and NO one cares, so good luck to the nurses, I hope that they all do not get fired and are out of work soon like what happen to me. It was wonderful working for the University of Michigan Health Hospital, until you speak up about the truth about the patient care.

Sciomanone1

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 5:33 a.m.

The Administration will just replace the nurses with workers from rent a nurse or maybe some of the nurses that walk around the hospital wearing a suit and not a nurse uniform will go back to doing the work that they went to school for and not walking around and telling others what to do and just sit in a office all day and just try to look perty and not do the work of a nurse.

Rebecca

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 7:46 p.m.

Nurses that are brought in to break the contract get paid about $150 an hour. Room and board also. The last time the nurses were on strike these nurses laughed at the University as they filled their pockets to prevent a 1% raise for the nurses that stand behind U of M. Do the math for an 8 hour shift they will be paying $1200. For a week Six thousand. Plus room and board. This is sad! I understand that the University is only talking concessions and will not discuss the problems with open minds. This is so sad because I know many nurses and I know the back breaking work they do.

Laura

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 5:22 a.m.

After reading most of the comments, I can honestly say I am deeply saddened. I work very hard everyday. I don't think I am more important than any other employee, but I do think that my hard work should be compensated. I work in a unit that uses a lot of OT to meet staffing needs. I take care of critically ill children, and my job is both physically and emotionally demanding. I am proud to be a unionized RN. My union insures that I am compensated for the holidays I work, the OT I pick up to meet staffing need, and that the benefit package I have is affordable so I can insure myself, and any future children I may have. It also ensures that I have vacation/sick time, pregnancy leave, and any other benefit we expect to have from our employers. I am taking a stand with my union, because I think that we as nurses deserve the benefits we have. I also believe that everyone deserves these things. It's not right that working class people are forced to keep making cuts while the rich get richer. Instead of arguing with each other we should be standing together. Together, we can make a differece. By standing up for our rights, we are taking a stand for everyone. I am not a "healthcare profiteer" by any means. I am an RN trying to make ends meets, just like everyone else. I just have the added benefit of having a union to give me a bigger voice.

Tracie L.

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 6:49 p.m.

Well said Laura! I know there are many other jobs out there that people are forced to work long hours without the proper compensation...Instead of being angry that nurses are fighting for the right to be fairly compensated....these other professions/job workers should stand up for themselves also! They do not deserve to be taken advantage of either...They shouldn't be paying 30% either! They shouldn't have to work 16 hour shifts and not get paid overtime either! If we all take cuts, everyone will be forced to take cuts in every profession, then there will be less money earned...less money spend...small businesses going bankrupt and we all then will end up jobless! Except for the rich that is...because then the working class will end up so weak that we all will just end minions of the rich!

snapshot

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 4:08 a.m.

These unions never talk specifics. Signs read no cuts but they want raises. They are the Michigan Difference. What the heck does that mean? Lets see mortality rates as compared to other hospitals. "Other nurses make more in other hospitals". Lets see some numbers? Talk of a strike.........that's good for the patients.....maybe the motto is "We're no longer paid enough to care about patient care". The "Michigan Difference" is that the cost is higher.

Dennis

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 6:11 a.m.

If you look at mortality rates you should also look at accuity. There is a reason that other hospitals around the state and country send ther sickest patients to U of M. And yes they are asking for a modest increase, but by looking at many of the comments posted that seems to be a criminal offense. I guess that it is OKay for the administration to get between 3 and 13 percent raises, without being asked for concessions. The Michigan difference is just a play on the Us own ad campaign,and not ment that the nurses are alone in making that difference. Finally the nurses that stay will care even if they do not win this fight against corperate greed, but the fact is that the cost of health care will continue to rise, there is more involved then just the cost related to a few good nurses.

eagleman

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 12:59 a.m.

The Nurses are not making a stand for patients. That is an untruth. An untruth meant to distract the public from the fact that nurses want to ADD to their contract, not subtract. That is an understandable objective, but considering that companies and unions everywhere have had to make sacrifice over the past three years, it is not one likely engender much sympathy among the general population. Of course the University is lying when they say they are hurting for money. That is a bald-faced lie. The university is rolling in cash. Honestly, I have little sympathy for either side. This is a smaller version of the NFL-NBA lockout strife. It is two groups doing very well arguing over a few more dollars and cents.

Matt Cooper

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 12:52 a.m.

Although I am not a nurse, I do work shoulder to shoulder as an ICU technician with some of the finest nurses to be found anywhere. It amazes me that some of you have such incredibly naive, self-centered, ignorant and downright nasty things to say about nurses. Simply by going to work, nurses expose themselves every day to blood, urine, stool, pus, serous fluids, vomit and other substances that you haven't even heard of. They deal with many different kinds of bacterial infections, viruses and wounds that would make you cry simply be seeing them. They wipe you mothers behind, and dry your childrens tears. They comfort your grandparents in their dying moments. They assuage your fears when your children are sick. They work as hard as anyone else to earn the RN licenses, as well as their college degrees. And for what? So that you can sit there and call them names, degrade their experience and mock their professionalism as being "me-me-me"? SHAME ON YOU! Remember the nasty things you say about nurses the next time you are sick or injured, or your kids are dying, or your parents or siblings are critically ill and need a NURSE to make them better. Shame on you.

Matt Cooper

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 1:40 a.m.

So they chose it. So what? Could you do it? Let's not act as if it's a job anybody could just walk into and perform at the high level of professionalism most UM nurses do each and every day. They make life and death decisions every day of the week, 24 hours a day. They have to maintain the highest levels of training and standards of care at all times. ONE mistake and you could lose your license. Do you work in such a demanding profession? Nurses deserve to be paid commensuarate with their overall level of care, education and experience. I don't personally know what that level is, but I am sick of the rude and nasty comments here. Nurses do one and only one thing: CARE FOR THE SICK AND DYING. People should have some respect for that, and keep their snotty comments to themselves. And I totally agree with you about teamwork. We have to work on the same goals or else, more than any other consideration, our patients suffer.

eagleman

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 1:04 a.m.

Well, they did CHOOSE to join this profession. No one forces them to expose themselves to the things you mention. The same holds true for cops, firefighters, and soldiers. They also are paid very well. That said, they do not deserve to be called names or attacked for holding a position. The same holds true for administrators. Without administrators there would be no hospital for nurses to work at. I think all sides need to recognize that they both are integral elements of a giant machine. Without one, the machine stops.

15crown00

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 10:50 p.m.

and you are going to do what if they do cut benefits?

AAFish

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 10:37 p.m.

Just amazing -- In this so-called liberal community, such a large number of [apparently mentally challenged] types are so anti-worker. What I seem to be hearing from many is essentially -- "I have a job that pays crap and has no benefits. It's a totally demeaning situation, and I hate it with a passion. But, rather than growing some balls and demanding better, and doing the very hard work that union organizing demands, I prefer to try to drag everyone else down to my miserable level. So-o-o-o much easier to just scapegoat people who are trying to insist on fair treatment." Go, Nurses!! As a former union member -- retired now -- I know exactly where you're coming from. Used to put up with the same corporate BS myself. (And, no, I was not a teacher, nurse, or government worker. I worked for an airline.)

eagleman

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 1:11 a.m.

Corporate BS? You mean the people WHO PROVIDED you with a job? That corporation? You took their money and their benefits, but yet you bash them. You are a hypocrite. You also are blind to the sins of unions. I myself am an Union worker. They protect the lazy, care only for themselves, and are run by people who have no concept of what make a business run. Truthfully, corporations and unions both are rotten. In modern times there is no difference between the two. Both exist for purposes of greed and their ends are designed for self-aggrandizement. It is ridiculous to suggest that either side cares much about the public need because the facts say otherwise. This is a business conflict between two money-driven entities.

that's a tuffy

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 12:20 a.m.

Right On AAF

Rebecca

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 9:53 p.m.

I find it amazing to see such jealousy with comments on this topic. The nurses are being asked to pay more than even Gov. Snyder is requesting. The profit margin is astronomical for the hosptial. They can still afford to build new buildings. The nurses are not saying that new buildings are not needed but not by a decrease in what they are paying the nurses. The nurses froze their salaries years ago when the health center was in trouble. They supported the institution. Because they are asking for adequate professional compensation does not make them the enemy. Nurses are educated professionals. If you work in any other corporate field you would have an attractive benefit package to keep your excellent workers. Do you think nurses deserve anything less? No way! They are fighting for keeping quality patient care by keeping quality nurses. Trust me you don't want an inexperienced nurse taking care of you when you are fighting for your life! Nurses do make the difference! Along with all employees at the health center. This hospital gets the worst of the worst. When patients cannot be helped at other facilities they are transferred to U of M. Most patient's are of a high level of acuity. Much higher than other hospitals. Put your support behind professional nurses. Don't degrade what nurses do. They will always be there for you.

Rebecca

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 9:50 p.m.

I find it amazing to see such jealousy with comments on this topic. The nurses are being asked to pay more than even Gov. Snyder is requesting. The profit margin is astronomical for the hosptial. They can still afford to build new buildings. The nurses are not saying that new buildings are not needed but not by a decrease in what they are paying the nurses. The nurses froze their salaries years ago when the health center was in trouble. They supported the institution. Because they are asking for adequate professional compensation does not make them the enemy. Nurses are educated professionals. If you work in any other corporate field you would have an attractive benefit package to keep your excellent workers. Do you think nurses deserve anything less? No way! They are fighting for keeping quality patient care by keeping quality nurses. Trust me you don't want an inexperienced nurse taking care of you when you are fighting for your life! Nurses do make the difference! Along with all employees at the health center. This hospital get the worst of the worst. When patients cannot be helped at other facilities they are transferred to U of M. Most patient's are of a high level of acuity. Much higher than other hospitals. Put your support behind professional nurses. Don't degrade what nurses do. They will always be there for you.

timjbd

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 9:25 p.m.

Sure can't ask any of these people to take cuts: <a href="http://www.collegiatetimes.com/databases/salaries/university-of-michigan-ann-arbor" rel='nofollow'>http://www.collegiatetimes.com/databases/salaries/university-of-michigan-ann-arbor</a> That would be punishing success.

timjbd

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 1:21 a.m.

Yeah, no RN's on that list either.

Marilyn Wilkie

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 10:30 p.m.

<a href="http://www.collegiatetimes.com/databases/salaries/university-of-michigan-ann-arbor?dept=nursing" rel='nofollow'>http://www.collegiatetimes.com/databases/salaries/university-of-michigan-ann-arbor?dept=nursing</a>

CobraII

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 9:12 p.m.

Everyone else pays there share why not the nurses? Who made them special? With unemployment around 20%, maybe its time to hire new nurses that would be happy to work for the pay &amp; benefits these people want to strike for!

Matt Cooper

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 12:55 a.m.

Show me a paystub of yours, from the university of michigan, that shows that you pay more for your health insurance than nurses. If you can't, all you are doing is spewing nonsense.

Stella Payer

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 8:59 p.m.

Nurses have changed the face of healthcare! Before the days Florence Nigthingale, hospitals conditions were obscene. It is nurses who fight for quality, effective, and safe patient care. Evidenced based research has proven nurse satisfaction directly correlates with patient satisfaction. Again I wil reiterate, this is NOT about $$! Nurses hold an altruistic perspective which has gained us respect and support from society. This is why the gallop pole survey has listed the nursing profession as the most trusted profession for 11 yrs and running. Our patients deserve nurses who are dedicated and compassionate as myself. Many of my colleagues and I have volunteered countless hours in community outreach programs, because we care! It is our duty and professional obligation to fight for what is right. If we allow administration to dismantle our structure than how will we have the power to fight for everyone else? I look forward to the day we succeed in health care reform, but until then we need to fight for what we have worked so hard for.

Mike

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 9:16 p.m.

Umm yeah.. so if we pay you more, you'll take some of the cost off our health bill? That's what you meant by &quot;fight for for everyone else&quot;, right? I don't think that's how the system works. Good luck with that strike thing you have going! Also, how's that happy hopey changey thing working for you?

Joe Payer

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 8:26 p.m.

k

Mike

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 6:44 p.m.

Really?!! Unionized RNs make that much? For the relatively small investment in education that they endured? Yeah, go ahead and strike. I'm sure there are more worthy replacements who would be grateful for the job.

Matt Cooper

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 12:58 a.m.

Relatively small investment? Well...if it's such a small investment, why not you pick up the roughly $50,000 tab it will end up costing for me to complete my RN. I'm sure that since it's such a small amount, you can surely just write a check to cover it, right?

thegatekeeper

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7:28 p.m.

oops, 100K*

thegatekeeper

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7:27 p.m.

I sure as hell don't make 80 grand a year- try half that (it more than suits my needs though, definitely no complaints)... and small investment in education? I was fortunate with scholarships, but I have friends who graduated with over 100, 000K in school-related debt and are still jobless, doing volunteer work to try and get experience so they have a shot at getting gainful nursing employment. There will always be a lowest bidder.

jll

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 5:22 p.m.

As I am reading these comments I have to remember there are always people out there that no matter what have to make negative comments and just want to stir the pot. And that there are many extremely ignorant persons out there. I am a UM Nurse, and very proud of what I do and of all my brother and sister RNs. We did not go into this profession because of the money we did this because this is who we are. Caregivers and Nurturers! I graduated in 1977 with a BSN making $4.85 an hour. My husband at the time worked for Ford Motor company making at least double that. I now make $39.00 an hour and have 34 years experience in this profession. And I knew when I took on this profession my life would never be the same. I have worked more holidays, weekends and off shifts than I can count. I have experienced the wonders of life and the awfulness of death. I have been spit on, vomited on, urinated on, stooled on, bled on, hit, punched, kicked, and called every name in the book. But you know what, I love this job and would not do anything else. And this makes me more vulnerable! Because I love my job, do I just sit back and watch the powers that be try to take away what I have so justly earned every working day of my life. No! And to the rest of you who are complaining about Nurses come and walk in my shoes any day you want. I can guarantee that working one day side by side in any Nurse shoes anywhere in this world will change your beliefs forever! If we accept what is being offered, we set a precedent that is unacceptable to the Nursing Profession as well as to Health Care everywhere..

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7:29 p.m.

I think UMMC nurses have earned what they are paid. You example is an excellent one, you started with low pay and have worked 3.5 decades for what you earn now. Typically, I support the policy that employes should pay a fair benefit split at 70/30 for health care, but not at UMMC because I feel the admin is too far over compensated. I think there are plenty of other places to make cuts than to the people who provide the most care.

FredMax

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 6:40 p.m.

Also remember that there will always be people that hold a responsible point of view that is contradictory to your own. $80K isnt a bad salary in these times, I know many people with very substantial credentials that are unable to find anything like this. I hope you understand the fotune to be in a profession that seems to have an ever increasing demand for employees. However, note that job hardship and years of experience do not project linear to a pay/benefits scale. Often there is only loosely tied to the value that one can bring to an employer. As an extreme example, consider a guy who spends 50 years of his life cleaning the restrooms; should he be making a 6 figure salary?

Basic Bob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 6:26 p.m.

Well, I think you make a fair wage considering your skills, education, experience, and working conditions. No argument. But I also believe there is no precedent in this contract negotiation. It is simply a contract. Don't take it personal.

Cathy Z.

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:21 p.m.

As a former U of M employee now working for the State of Michigan, I would hope that the nurses at U of M know just how lucky they are- We at the State in comparable positions may be asked to take a 5% pay CUT this year; we are (illegally) forced to contribute 3% of our gross income to what the State calls a &quot;healthcare retirement contribution&quot;; many of our facilities are filthy and dangerous; nepotism and favoritism run rampant; job security (what's that??&quot;); and finally, our pay and benefits for the registered nurses does not even come close to the U's!! I would love to have MNA represent us as well, but that unfortunately will never happen. The economy is bad all over- it is becoming much harder for seasoned nurses as well as new grads to get full-time jobs, as employers don't want to pay the associated benefits. Although I want more, and I want to be appreciated as well for my skills and hard work, recognition in the form of good pay/benefits/working conditions has not been in the cards (for many of us). Having and holding on to a job is paramount nowadays- remember that in your negotiations. Life is certainly unfair &amp; sometimes unjust, but there of many of us who are far worse off than you.

timjbd

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 6:46 p.m.

The economy is bad all over and so your solution is to make sure everyone gets gutted? How about getting out on the line and supporting them? When you're in a sinking boat, it does not help you to sink the other boats around you.

that's a tuffy

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:18 p.m.

If the U of M really wanted a 30% cost sharing with the union they should have started at 40% and settled for 30%. I can't hardly believe the poor strategy on both sides. The union leaders don't seem to be able to release clear cut and simple quotes to the media. All of us observers argue back and forth on these threads trying to convince each other of what is really happening. If I was the mediator I would set the insurance payment at 25 % and give the union a 5% pay increase spread over 5 years. The health care industry is healthy (sorry), proven by the expansion at St. Joe, Saline , Chelsea and the U. Management can't keep crying the blues. The guys on Pawn Stars would have had this settled long ago. They understand the art of negotiation.

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7:21 p.m.

I am glad they did not do that. I do not like that kind of negotiation. It is unethical to start high when you are willing to take something less. I consider that dishonest. I prefer dealing with someone who is upfront and not playing games. Same thing goes on with budgets. &quot;ask for more than you need, not what you need because you will get cut.&quot; I would never put up with that kind of thinking.

Ingrid herkhof

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:12 p.m.

Snoop dog, Who are you and what do you do for a living ? You seem to have an agenda against us. Will this whole issue impact you and your family ?

timjbd

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:57 p.m.

I haven't seen a single person suggest that cuts at the very top are warranted nor acceptable. The only topics up for discussion are where and how much to cut the middle and below. This is how the corporate media has controlled the weak minded into believing the rich must never be expected to contribute any further. Only the powerless can be expected to suffer when times are tough. &quot;Don't punish the job creators!&quot; (Effective) Tax rates at the top have never been lower and as that trend line continues downward, so does employment. As desperate people scream for cuts, cuts, cuts, the trend line for the middle class continues right down toward the poverty line. That should tell you something about the &quot;job creators&quot; and their BS about putting tax cuts for them to work for the rest of us. <a href="http://www.oecd.org/document/53/0,3343,en_2649_33933_41460917_1_1_1_1,00.html" rel='nofollow'>http://www.oecd.org/document/53/0,3343,en_2649_33933_41460917_1_1_1_1,00.html</a> <a href="http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate_welfare/real_tax_rates_plummet.php" rel='nofollow'>http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate_welfare/real_tax_rates_plummet.php</a> <a href="http://tinyurl.com/2ctpgew" rel='nofollow'>http://tinyurl.com/2ctpgew</a> Everybody should get out there with the U of M nurses. The line they are trying to hold supports all the rest of us.

snoopdog

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:35 p.m.

&quot;We have built the reputation the University of Michigan Health System enjoys and we work hard every day to uphold that reputation," said Katie Oppenheim, president of the U-M nurses union.&quot; Legends in their own minds ! &quot;The nurses, Oppenheim said, want a "fair contract," with no cuts to benefits.&quot; Fair = No cuts ? I think not ! &quot;&quot;We will win this fight,&quot; Oppenheim told the crowd.&quot; Ain't no way ! Good Day

jns131

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:01 p.m.

What I am seeing here is this. Nurses like the teachers don't want to pay for it so they strike to keep what they have. I hate to say it the teachers are being forced to pay more for health care and guess what nurses, so will you. Don't like over time? Then don't be a nurse or better yet? Leave at the end of your shift. This way you get to go home and be with your family at the end of the day. Get use to it nurses, times they are a changing and so do we all. The bus drivers in Ann Arbor pay $4000 out of pocket before their medical kicks in. So I would think twice before going nuts on having to pay more for anything. Everyone wants something and feel they are not getting enough. Good luck.

Basic Bob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:34 p.m.

All those huge salaries and raises for administrators have an impact on future negotiations. Do you think the administrators care? No, because in their minds they deserve it. However, nurses are drawing the wrong line in the sand. Threatening a strike over payroll deduction for health care benefits is not going to generate much sympathy.

jns131

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:02 p.m.

I totally agree with you on this one. Need to draw the line in the right direction.

Ingrid herkhof

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:06 p.m.

SarSaline, I challenge you to spend a shift in any one of our shoes. How about in the Trauma Burn Unit orany other unit ? Hey how about a midnight shift . You will see us in a whole new way, because I can tell, you haven't a clue. This is not just a part time job to supplement our husbands income for many of us. IIn many instances we are the sole supporters of our families. We have worked long and hard for what we have. And I don't need a haircut, thanks

snoopdog

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:39 p.m.

You may not need a haircut but you are going to get one. Makes more sense to negotiate with the hair stylist and select your cut, rather than leaving it up to them to make that decision ! Good Day

Joe Hood

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 4:15 a.m.

What's up with the red shirts; the Verizon strikers are wearing them as well? All of this hullabaloo across the country seems centrally coordinated and frankly a little scary.

CincoDeMayo

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:44 p.m.

It IS scary - what is going on with the working class, that is.

Chelsea8226

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:02 a.m.

If you've been fortunate enough to never have a loved one be critically ill then consider yourselves lucky. Consider yourselves even luckier to have been in that situation and be at an exceptional institution with extraordinary medical and nursing care. The care provided at UMHS is nothing short of extraordinary. It took every employee working there the make UMHS one of the top hospitals in the nation. I am a ICU nurse at UMHS and before working in the ICU I worked in Bone Marrow Transplant. When graduating from nursing school 5 years ago I decided to begin my career at UMHS for several reasons. I believed it was the best hospital in the area for benefits, retirement and provided opportunities that my current job at SJMHS did not. When applying for jobs I looked at the DMC, SJMHS and UMHS. Nothing compared to UMHS. Sure, I'd take a little bit of a pay cut, but the opportunities to advance within the system, save for my future and further my education out weighed the difference in pay. I am lucky enough to love my job and my co-workers. I go to work and KNOW that I make a difference in someone's life. Its' not easy work but I didn't become a nurse because I thought it would be easy. Where I work we usually lose more patients then we save. We get the sickest of the sick; the patients who are transferred to us from the DMC, SJMHS, Henry Ford and other systems that can't be managed there anymore. We provide care that those facilities can't and in the 2 years I've worked in the ICU I've never seen our physicians transfer a patient to another facility b/c we couldn't manage them. The skills I have learned in my 5 years of nursing I didn't learn just from nursing school. I've learned mostly from the experienced nurses on my unit. Experienced nurses that will leave UMHS along with their expertise if negotiations continue in this manner. Patient care WILL be compromised and do you really want your loved one, or even yourself in that bed?

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7:16 p.m.

I think Chelsea's post is honest and accurate. She is spot on by saying Pt care will suffer if experienced nurses leave. That however probably will not happen. Experienced nurses have climbed the pay scales and are less likely to leave because leaving means starting all over at another hospital: starting pay, low seniority on the shift schedule. Pt care can also suffer from reduced numbers, which might happen if the union holds fast and layoffs occur. So you wait a little longer in discomfort for your nurse who may be soon covering a lot more patients. No, its the inexperienced nurses who will more likely leave either from layoffs or lower pay raises. Unions eat their young. Keep what they have at the expense of those with less seniority being laid off. The transfer of pts to UM from other Mich hospitals has been going on for decades. The real scandal at UMMC is the outrageous pay of administrators. I don't see how they can asks nurses, or anyone else to take cuts when they stuff their pockets so full of cash. No leadership. Maybe if they started by cutting waste they could gain some trust.

Dlr727

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 5:50 p.m.

Uh..(or should I say duh!) I believe that Chelsea's comment about patient's care being compromised was due to the fact that experienced nurses would leave the field. Why do so many people choose to jump to erroneous conclusions and then jump down the poster's throat? And as to Snoopdogs comments: Do you have proof or facts that people do not come from other facilities to UMHS? I know for a fact that people transfer to that facility on a regular basis. I have had family and friends do both on several occasions. Seems like your comment was rubbish, pure and simple.

thecompound

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:28 p.m.

Sounds like a veiled threat? Isn't there some kind of oath like physicians?

jns131

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:05 p.m.

So, let me reread this. You don't get what you want I get less care from you? Scary thought. My health will be compromised because you didn't get the health care and pay you think so richly deserve? I think I will be checking into another hospital thank you very much.

Jack Gladney

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:02 a.m.

@Cm I doubt that your cafeteria would be willing to meet my salary requirements. I am a great cook though. Dinner?

CincoDeMayo

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:42 p.m.

cm you have an acidic sense of humor for sure, but that was a good one

cm

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 4:04 a.m.

What dinner? Only thing you serve is whine.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:46 a.m.

you should be so lucky

Peggy Welch

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:35 p.m.

Nurses are the &quot;front-line&quot; receivers attending to the needs of the public in healthcare crisis. The US Military awards people in that position &quot;Hazard Duty&quot; pay. The &quot;REST&quot; of the University does not have to deal with extreme illness, and the resultant bodily fluids that put us at a much higher risk of contracting, and passing along illnesses to our families. There have already been enough concessions. If you want the &quot;Cream of the Crop&quot; to continue building your Corporate Reputation, commuting, and feeling a sense of pride in Professionalism, I urge this Institution to rethink it's values.

thecompound

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:27 p.m.

So now we are comparing working in a war zone to working in a stateside hospital? Over. The. Top.

Deb Anderson

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:32 p.m.

I've worked at UofM for over 20 years. I do not belong to a union nor am I working in an administrative capacity. I'm lucky to be earning 2/3's of an entry-level RN salary and I have a four year degree not including the years of experience I've been here and elsewhere in the health care field. So this burden will be placed on those of us like me to carry the weight to make non-sustainable health care coverage free for only nurses. If they get it all, so should everyone but it will never happen. I think we can all do the math. I am very resentful at this &quot;me first&quot; mentality. UofM offers us a very generous benefit package all around and if you bench mark other hospitals, just try to figure out how they are better to their employees. Don't like it here because you have to contribute just like everyone else? Quit. There's plenty of others out there who would be pleased to work here. How will walking out on every patient be a benefit for them or to our institution? But I'm sure you'll all get what you want -- eventually off of others' backs because we'll be carrying your entitlement load, bitterly. UofM is in the black because of good planning with an anticipation for what the future holds, an example to both our state and federal government of what can be accomplished for the good of all (patients/family/staff) that is fair and generous while remaining fiscally responsible. But I guess that's a thing of the past, how old-fashioned of me... why should we work somewhere that thrives within its means when nothing else does anymore? I'm clutching my pearls.

CincoDeMayo

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:39 p.m.

From glacialerratic's earlier post: &quot;Aetna C.E.O. Ronald Williams has helped purge millions of members from the company's rolls; his total annual compensation in 2008 was $24,300,112. Angela Braly, who has promised that WellPoint &quot;will not sacrifice profitability,&quot; also saw a raise, to $9,844,212. Cigna's Edward Hanway saw his pay cut in half and still hauled in $12,236,740, but he was forced to manage a major P.R. crisis after the company initially refused to approve a liver transplant for a 17-year-old girl, which it said was &quot;outside the scope of the plan's coverage.&quot; She died just hours after Cigna changed its mind and decided it would pay for a new liver after all. Despite a 75 percent pay drop in 2008, cutting him down to a humiliating $3,241,042, UnitedHealth Group's Stephen Hemsley put on a brave face for Congress, assuring legislators: &quot;Our mission at UnitedHealth Group is to help people live healthier lives.&quot; UnitedHealth has been fined tens of millions of dollars for claims-processing violations (i.e., stiffing patients and doctors). Hemsley's predecessor, William McGuire, resigned amid a stock-options backdating scandal in 2006. He still walked away with nearly half a billion dollars in stock options. Hemsley surrendered $190 million in options himself, but with $744,232,068 left over, he should be fine.&quot; Matt Kapp, &quot;The Sick Business of Health-Care Profiteering,&quot; Vanity Fair, September 24, 2009

CincoDeMayo

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:39 p.m.

&quot; I'm lucky to be earning 2/3's of an entry-level RN salary&quot; How much is that? $46,000? (Two thirds of the oft quoted average nurse salary of $70,000?) Since, you don't actually say, it's hard to know. Depending on your job, that's not too bad. I can see how one might be happy with that - commiserate with the work. And I can see how you would be unhappy with paying more toward your premium and see it as a pay cut as expressed by your statement in following comments: &quot;BTW, I have no qualm about what I earn in comparison to anything comparable locally in the field I'm in but that's about to change dramatically when my premiums go up significantly...&quot; That's the same problem many workers are having - this increase in contributions undermines what could be considered (sometimes barely) a fair wage. It's too bad it sounds like you were in a position of having to agree to this &quot;pay cut&quot;. However, the decrease you are taking is not going toward keeping the nurses from having to take one. It is to finance the hospital and its administration. It will go toward those buildings that you find necessary. And, I am no expert, some of those buildings may BE necessary. Certainly there are costs associated with being a top notch institution. And those costs include paying for top notch technology, administrators, doctors, clerical staff, etc. The key is balancing those costs. The key is the overall cost structure. I think the nursed (and you) have a case. Compensation and costs are lopsided. There needs to be more fiscal responsibility and oversight of salaries.

Dennis

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:27 a.m.

Deb is if you make 2/3s of what aRN make then you are in a different pay scale, and pay less for healthcare. look at what the U publishes. The nurses will pay what doug strong paysand he makes 600000 per year and was not asked to give anything upto get his 50000 grand anual increase. I guess that is living in the means of the U though, and that is why we have a union to make sure that this institution that is making money does not make more by taking away from us.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:42 a.m.

I would really like all the money I have been paying for insurance at the U back since we get FREE healthcare............ that is a bold statement.Where did you get that info from? I pay 15% like all other employees did, I feel that when the U raised your premiums YOU should have stuck together and said NO!

Bertha RN

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:37 a.m.

Nurses get free coverage??? Really? That is so not the case! I've also worked at the U for a long time as a nurse and just left, but I valued my time there. However, what you are saying is ridiculous and ignorant. Do you even know what a nurse is or what a nurse does? Nurses make up 70% of the workforce within the healthcare system, and frankly, unless you are a nurse's aide or a nurse yourself, worked at a patient's bedside, or have even required the care of a nurse...you do not realize what we go through and what we put into our work. It's never just a paycheck, and every bit of our person is invested in that job. It's not about money, and it is every bit about making someone's sickness, surgery, or even death more tolerable. And guess what, with years of experience comes expertise and skill that you can't learn in a textbook or from any school...the real learning comes after. Nurses are at that bedside when needed 24/7 while doctors walk in a couple times a day for 5 min. rounds if you're lucky. We're the ones who see when things are going wrong, and the expert nurse tells the doctor what the patient needs. We make the worst of times bearable, for both patients and families. None of the nurses are asking to be rich, and I guarantee, none of the nurses joined the profession for wealth because it's a thankless job...but do I value what we do over other professions? Yeah, I do. You know why? Nothing is more real to a human than the reality of facing illness or death, or watching a loved one go through it. And when you face that. I hope you have an excellent nurse to show you the value in what we do. Because in those moments, WE MAKE THE DIFFERENCE! This union is just asking to not be slashed, and if the U wants to retain the best, then they need to value those seasoned experts that they've managed to retain for so long, cause I guarantee, now working for a competitor, our hospital will be looking to snatch up what the U administration is stupid enough to lose.

Deb Anderson

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:33 a.m.

BTW, I have no qualm about what I earn in comparison to anything comparable locally in the field I'm in but that's about to change dramatically when my premiums go up significantly to entitle nurses with free health coverage. Someone will have to pay for it and it will come from the backs of others. Their stance is elitist and counter-productive for the good of all, especially for the patients.

Deb Anderson

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:22 a.m.

The shiny new building is replacing an antiquated series of very old buildings that have become obsolete due to age, layout, and the ability to update the latest and greatest equipment that keeps us competitive and allows us to provide the best of care. Mott is the newest building of the bunch and it was constructed in 1969. The women's hospital was built in Dr. Kildare's day and trust me, it shows -- I keep expecting to see Dr. Gillespie wheel out of the elevator every time I'm over there. The new shiny building is replacing Mott, Women's, Holden, and the Adololescent Psych hospitals. And it's about time.

1bit

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 11:15 p.m.

Deb - the counterargument to your post is that you should make more money, rather than nurses making less. Some would also argue that the building boom at UMHS, for perhaps nonexistent increases in patient volume, is questionable at best and probably not fiscally responsible. If nurses are paying 20% of their health care benefits (like the private sector) then why ask them (or you) to pay more? For another shiny building?

Bob

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:19 p.m.

Nurses, I am sorry to break this to you but, here goes... YOU are not &quot;The Michigan Difference&quot; The Difference (if indeed it exists at all) is that a health system works together for the good of the patients. Not Doctors, Not Nurses, Not admin, Not canteen staff, Not cleaners - but all together. The rest of the hospital took a pay freeze two years ago. The nurses didn't. The rest of the hospital is now asked to pay a little more towards their very generous benefits. Why not the nurses? Join in with the rest of the hospital. Try to stop thinking of just yourselves. That would be The Michigan Difference.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:03 a.m.

Anyone at all can get a union so why don't you and your fellw workers fight a little harder for what you want/wanted. We had a contract that was in place and that is why we got a raise, BUT not all RNs got a raise. Check your facts. Just because things were crammed down your throat it doen't make them right!

highlandlass1592

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:23 a.m.

Actually, nurses salaries did not increase due to finagling by administrators who forced a non-sensical career track. I did not receive a cost of living increase

cm

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:32 a.m.

Wow...talk about the leader of the pack. The pack who is on the fast track to the bottom! Why would you want the largest group of workers to join you at the bottom? Common sense dictates that you would want them at the top, giving you a precedent to aspire, so your life could be better. I read the bitterness in your sentences and the venom it produces is palpable. You need to turn your ship around, sir.

Joe Payer

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:53 p.m.

Your Michigan Difference is exactly where things are going .... South! Lets stop putting blame for who is and is not the sole care taker of the patients and yet reflect that the truth is we are all people trying to make a living. If you take away from the benefits , you will see alot of talented workers flee this state. Do you wanna live in a state where Healthcare is second best?

thegatekeeper

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:11 p.m.

As a new nurse at UMHS as well as a UM alumnus, I am grateful for the opportunity to work at a hospital where I had my education as a student. I am even more grateful to simply have a job (even though there is a large nursing shortage across the country, it is very difficult to be hired as a new grad after the crash of 2008). I can certainly see the merits of some of the opposition- It's incredibly pretentious of us as nurses to claim we are the sole part of the &quot;Michigan Difference.&quot; More often than not, patients come to UM because of the advanced research, novel treatments for difficult maladies and the overall reputation of the facility. That reputation encompasses everyone from my friends and colleagues on maintenance to those who wear long white coats. However, even though people may not come to UM &quot;FOR&quot; the nursing care, more often than not, they find that the person who is with them at the bedside, day and night for 12 hours is the person who really makes or breaks their experience. We craft our practice, from the science of medications and ventilators, to the art of simply sitting there and listening to the stories of your childhood farm or distracting you and making you laugh while the doctor is performing a painful procedure. While I understand that the United States is in big trouble right now and teetering on the brink of disaster, nurses are not the totter. The CEO of UMHS had a pay raise from 2009 to 2010 which is more than my entire year's salary, putting him at a total of $600,000 a year. Mr. Strong has an MBA degree- he has no medical training. He is not there on the frontline being splattered with bodily fluids, being yelled at due to policies put in place by management that we could lose our jobs if we violate or having their back injured from physically manipulating people without the proper equipment and resources. However, he also isn't there when I get hugged by a patient and his wife, thanking me for everything, with tears in

Terri

Mon, Aug 15, 2011 : 4:21 p.m.

gatekeeper: First, the plural of &quot;anecdote&quot; isn't &quot;data.&quot; Second, to suggest that the people who've been at this longer than you have &quot;clouded judgment&quot; is a huge mistake. Pay attention to what people who have been nurses longer than you are saying. And if you don't, buff if your resume, because it would be sad if you were shocked by what's ahead AND not prepared to change careers.

thegatekeeper

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:55 p.m.

I'm sorry, I agree with ViSHa. Also, just because I am a new nurse does not mean I don't know anything about what's going on- if anything I am not so vested in the bureaucratic workings of hospital politics that my objectivity is so clouded yet. Yes, we are important, yet unless people have been frequent flyers that have had good experience with the nursing staff, they are not coming to us simply for the nursing care. The average layman doesn't even know the clear distinction between a nurse and a doctor... I have anectodal evidence of this from my own patients.

ViSHa

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:02 a.m.

I'm sorry, but that is a stretch. I am having a lot of trouble believing that, say for example, a cancer/transplant/whatever patient would base their choice of hospital not on cutting edge medical advances, not on a particular renown physician, not on closeness to where they are, not on what their insurance company allows, but rather on their nursing care (or it's perceived reputation). I truly think nurses are an extremely valuable asset to a hospital, but the arrogance I am reading is really over the top.

Meg

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:41 a.m.

You're a new nurse. I'm glad you're enthusiastic. You're absolutely wrong that people don't come to UMHS for the nursing care, because that is why patients come to any hospital. The five or ten minutes of time spent with your doc would be done outpatient. Patients come to the hospital for the 24-hour skilled care nurses provide. We are why they're inpatient. Our care makes the difference, and there are a number of rigorous studies supporting the fact that when patient-nurse ratios rise, morbidity and mortality both increase. Excellent nursing care makes the difference for outcomes, not just experiences.

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:21 p.m.

Congrats. The most sane post on this whole story. You sound like a very dedicated professional. I would, however, also add another reason patients come to UM---it may be their insurers preferred health care facility.

1bit

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:04 p.m.

1. UMHS is still in the black. 2. Projected deficits for UMHS are based upon inadequately filling new buildings, yet there appears to be no pause or slowdown considered in new building projects. The pretense of asking the nurses to take cuts in benefits is based upon a non-reality: that UMHS may lose money in the future. If I were a nurse, it wouldn't make sense to me to accept the cuts. This is purely a power move by UMHS because they must feel that there is little risk in losing quality nurses (i.e. the competition must be paying less). To the latter point, it would be helpful in articles like this to know not only what the nurses at UMHS are making (salary/benefits) but what the competition is paying locally and/or what peer institutions are paying their nurses.

thegatekeeper

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:28 p.m.

Many nurses come to UM for the benefits (good health insurance coverage at a decent rate, even for families)..our pay is sometimes up to half as much as competing facilities- however, our patient ratios are often more appropriate than other facilities, especially those that are non-unionized (1:5 max, 1:3-4 average and 1:1-2 in the ICU versus 1:8 max at other hospitals). As a new nurse, my salary is something in the ballpark of $45, 000 a year (we get paid hourly so it's difficult to calculate exactly). I believe the most senior nurses on my unit (15-30 years experience) are paid between 70 and 80 grand per year. I have less than one year of experience, so if things were to get bad, I would hold out for a few more months, but probably go elsewhere when I reach the 1 year mark, as sad as it would make me to leave a place I like working.

SalineSara

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10 p.m.

Stop whining girls, sit up straight in the barber chair and take your shave and a hair cut.

jns131

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:10 p.m.

To add fuel to the fire, school bus drivers of Ann Arbor, including the custodians and the food workers all took a bath last year. Trust you me. Working conditions still have not improved and it won't at UM. Why do people who work in Ann Arbor think they can make a mint here when everyone is cutting back? Plymouth Canton just ousted their unionized bus drivers. Talk about lay offs and no jobs. Just a thought.

cm

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:25 p.m.

Why doesn't AA news have moderators that get rid of trolls, sock puppets, and flamers? This inflammatory rhetoric is nonsense and completely ignorant.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:32 a.m.

We are not all girls just since we are nurses. And really fighting for good working conditions doesn't make us whiners it makes us strong people with a backbone, willing to fight and not wlling to sit back and watch the middle class die. BUT from your comments you probably don't fit in the middle class

thegatekeeper

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:12 p.m.

Thanks for trolling! (rolls eyes)

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:50 p.m.

Never been a Nurse, don't want to be a Nurse but when I'm in the hospital I could never do without a Nurse.

Michael Long

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:44 p.m.

Quite frankly, I'm nauseated at how UMHS has distorted the situation to make the RNs look like the bad guys. They quote a median RN's salary in the neighborhood of $70K, never telling the public that this number is skewed by the nurse practitioners and nurse anesthetists who make $90K+, and that those nurses have gone back to school for masters degrees for those positions. The RNs who are ADN or BSN-prepared (i.e.-the majority of the RNs who provide the daily patient care) who make in the neighborhood of $70K a year have been at the hospital around 15 years. After almost 4 years @ UMHS, I was making about $26/hr, which works out to less than $50K/year (which brings up another distortion from UMHS: the public records of salaries show an annual salary based on a 40 hr work week, when the majority of RNs have a 36 hr work week, meaning I never once made the annual salary listed in my public record). After Gov. Snyder started talking about forcing higher state worker contributions to healthcare costs AND a multiyear wage freeze (UMHS is the ONLY state affiliated hospital, meaning all of the workers, RNs included, are part of mandatory state worker wage laws), I got concerned enough to start looking elsewhere, as did many of my colleagues. Not only was compensation becoming an issue, but working environment as well. Tech positions and hours are being cut (which you don't hear about because the techs @ UMHS aren't unionized) and any RN worth their license will tell you that the availability of a tech on the unit makes all the difference in workload. Management support for adequate staffing is going away as top-down pressure to meet budgetary demands increases. AND cost of living in Michigan keeps rising. In all, I decided to go to Colorado, where my benefits are comparable to when I started @ UMHS and I'm being paid a more competitive wage, along with lower cost of living. Make no mistake, nurses will leave UMHS and the state if they aren't compensated fairly.

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 7 p.m.

Well moving is always an option. You have to look though at a lot more than wages and benefit packages. Cost of living is a key issue that must be investigated. Pay might be higher in some areas because living there is expensive. Here is a blog with responses to a question about nursing pay in Co. in 2008. It is kind of interesting. Can't speak to its reliability: <a href="http://allnurses.com/colorado-nurses/r-n-pay-296558.html" rel='nofollow'>http://allnurses.com/colorado-nurses/r-n-pay-296558.html</a>

thecompound

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:23 p.m.

I understand your points, but personally, I would not want to be treated by someone with the kind of ethics where they have no problem walking away from responsibilities (i.e. walking away from mortgage/default).

Seebee

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:36 p.m.

Yeah.. I don't think the housing market will keep people here.. go to your new job paying more money, secure a new mortgage you can afford at a better rate, get more house for less money than you are currently paying and just walk away from your old mortgage.. besides it was probably upsidedown.. and in a few years it is all off your record anyway right? SO stay here for less money work harder to pay for a house in an economy that will be very slow to recover.. yeah it is hard to see why anyone stays.. but I for one am grateful that they do. Please stop chasing away/encouraging our competent work force to leave. I and my family would like them to stay here.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:30 a.m.

No wouldn't count on the bad housing market keeping people here. People will just walk away like the thousands of others that already have. People will not stay if they can't afford it

Dlr727

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 11:43 p.m.

If you read his reply, he did leave. He is in Colorado making more money with better benefits.

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:17 p.m.

The housing market will keep many people put whether they like it or not.

SalineSara

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:04 p.m.

Then leave, work elsewhere you are free to choose. Always measure the true value of an employee on where they end up in their next job. Keep us posted please.

Dlr727

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:33 p.m.

I have watched the comments in the blogs over the last several years as the economy in Michigan has gone steadily down hill. First the enemy was the UAW workers...gone. Next it was teachers, police, and fire fighters...going, going, going. Now, it's the nurses. Who will be next? I could understand the argument that this is all the unions fault if things had been getting better since all of these groups have been rendered ineffective. Everyone keeps complaining about how much all of these bloodsuckers make, how much they should pay, and why they are the reason Michigan is struggling. When are people going to figure out that if you keep shrinking the wages (and making people pay more for benefits affects wages!) of the middle class that your economy has no where to go but down? Who is going to be around to drive that economy? All of you complaining about what you pay, the jobs you've lost, etc. will only be hurt more as our economy continues its downward spiral. Do you honestly believe that by cutting wages for so many people that it will end up helping you in the long run with a bigger pay raise, property values increasing, and a stable economy? I for one am happy to have well paid teachers, nurses, firefighters, and police officers. They are my fellow Michiganders who are in the mess right along with the rest of us.

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 6:48 p.m.

In re to unions: if you search online for &quot;best states to do business,&quot; &quot;best states for jobs,&quot; you will find the the states attracting business (= jobs) are right to work states that offer low business taxes. Michigan is not near the top. Michigan lost so much population with people leaving the state, we lost a seat in Congress. Jobs are the key issue and Michigan needs to do much more to move up in the business friendly rankings. The alternative? Raising taxes?

Dlr727

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:48 p.m.

I am no Obama supporter either. But the fact is, Michigan has been imploding on itself for a whole lot longer than Obama has been in office. It started with Bush. I'm sure you would be happy to blame Jenny G., and she was certainly complicit. And quite frankly, I used to lean much more to the right until I began to see what their true purposes were and how terribly it was affecting my family and friends. This is not an all black or white issue. There is fault and responsibility on both sides and they had better figure out how to save the middle class before we end up destitute.

SalineSara

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:28 a.m.

Good grief blaming Bush. What about the $800 billion Obama stimulus? How did that work out? lynel: Look it up and do your homework. Here is the reuired reading to get you started. <a href="http://www.senate.michigan.gov/sfa/Publications/Issues/StateRevenueTenYears/StateRevenueTenYears.pdf" rel='nofollow'>http://www.senate.michigan.gov/sfa/Publications/Issues/StateRevenueTenYears/StateRevenueTenYears.pdf</a>

Dlr727

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 11:42 p.m.

@SalineSara I don't know if your facts are accurate or not. But I do know that for many years the Bush tax cuts have been in affect. Those were supposed to be helping us too. I don't know about you, but they sure haven't helped me. I pay a lot less in property tax now that my house value is lower. I've given up luxuries, taken pay cuts, and pay towards my benefits. But, I'm still willing to make a higher contribution to keep my community vibrant and viable. I also think that we can stop corporate welfare and catering to special interests and big business. Why is it the little guy who is just trying to make a living that gets hit, but the wealthy get cuts and no change in their living status?

lynel

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:24 p.m.

&quot;The fact is tax revenue is down 40% from 10 years ago with less people workling.&quot; Great &quot;fact&quot; where did it come from?

SalineSara

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:06 p.m.

The fact is tax revenue is down 40% from 10 years ago with less people workling. So exactly how do you propose to bridge that revenue gap??????????

jimbob24

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:14 p.m.

unions = mediocrity I like the sign &quot;taking a stand for our patients&quot;...if that isn't a lie. ...and when's the last time you heard someone going to the UM for the great nursing care?

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:15 p.m.

I don't think Jim is necessarily correct, I just think there are some outlandish claims being made due to the passion concerning this issue. No profession is immune to slackers.

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:09 p.m.

If you think Jim is right your entitled to your opinion.

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:05 p.m.

Kind of like a lot of the blanket statements being spouted above by UM employees?

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:51 p.m.

Nice blanket statement. I'm sure alot of research went into that one.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:45 p.m.

Ummmm, all the time. Where do you go, Jimbob?????

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:04 p.m.

To Marilyn, I'm a union worker. I am not the problem. Teachers, police officers, paramedics, firefighters, road workers, etc. are NOT the enemy. If you're jealous of our benefits, FIGHT FOR YOUR OWN!, not against ours. The rich who created this crisis are putting middle class families against each other. We live here, pay taxes, work hard &amp; try to support our families too!!!!

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:48 a.m.

Saline Sara do you even work? Or do you have the luxury of staying home?

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:03 p.m.

I agree with your premise for certain union workers, but the game changes for those paid with tax dollars.

cm

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:51 p.m.

The nurses are asking for raises, Oppenheim said at a press conference in early August..............HEY AA NEWS.......I think you got this &quot;quote&quot; wrong. The nurses are NOT asking for raises.

cm

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:40 p.m.

@Marlyn Wilkes: It's thinking like yours that has to be changed. Turn your statement around. You should say: Why can't we pay better premiums? We should do something about it! Don't be such a negative person. Don't watch the world go by and complain. Get involved and actually do something.

Marilyn Wilkie

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 10:16 p.m.

cm - (don't know YOU real name), I retired from the UMHS and we were all asked to pay more for health insurance..why not them? As someone said, maybe it shuld be based on how much one makes. Then the average nurse would pay about 2 1/2 times what I made. Your comment did not make much sense to me. It was negative.

timjbd

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:33 p.m.

The corporate 'divide and conquer' strategy requires a large supply of fear and ignorance. These boards prove they have a steady supply of both. As people see their own pay and benefits stripped away, these corporations (U of M hospital certainly qualifies) and their factoti on talk radio and Fox News make sure that the response is to attack those others who still have decent pay and benefits. As if bringing everyone down was the only solution. People do not object to the University building yet another $billion wing onto the hospital complex nor to adding another gargantuan dorm but if the nurses don't agree to give up their hard-fought benefits? That's going too far.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:41 p.m.

There are a great many people who seem to think that this is simply about greedy nurses wanting to rip off a great institution. When in reality it is a battle against corporate greed and the demise of the middle class. If we lose this battle, every working, middle class person, family, single mother, etc, will lose too. We will not lose, we are not going to give up, or we might all end up living on a compound somewhere... with a bunch of Llamas and goats....hmmmm.

tim

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:26 p.m.

If UM was really fair the contribution towards health insurance would be a percentage of take home pay. The way it works now is that the employees that are least able to afford a health insurance premium are paying the highest percentage of their pay check.

j5

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:42 a.m.

How is that &quot;fair&quot;? Is the cost of delivering health care magically cheaper for someone who makes less? Fair is compensation being determined by the intersection of willingness to work and willingness to pay NOT some arbitrary standard set by an economic cartel or force of law let alone some spectator on the sidelines. Fair is every participant in the market having a hand to play and taking the best deal they can find NOT one group colluding to undermining the position of another group. We can't even begin to talk about fair when there are individuals openly forming economic cartels. This practice has long since been forbidden by law amongst all market participants with the notable exception of unions. Somehow they have managed to escape scrutiny.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:20 a.m.

They broke it down into tiers.......problem is anyone making over $53,000 is responsible to pay the sae as say someone making $200,000 or even $750,000 like some people at the U

J Shaker

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:51 p.m.

i heart nurses

jcj

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:46 p.m.

@highlandlass1592 &quot;If it wasn't for nurses like myself, this hospital would not be able to continue to be considered a world-class institution. &quot; And if it weren't for the custodians, food service workers, clerks, and skilled workers it &quot;would not be able to continue to be considered a world-class institution. &quot; Everyone wants to think THEY are the most important component of any organization! Nobody is as important as think think they are! Get off your high horese!

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:19 a.m.

I have yet to see any of the nurses complaining abut the wages of physicians. Upper management are the ones that need to learn to appreciate all the work all the little people do! Ad srry to say but to be honest without nurses you wouldn't need ancillary staff as there woul be NO patients there to clean up after,cook for, transport etc.

highlandlass1592

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:19 a.m.

While ancillary staff play a valuable roll, they are not able to provide the care necessary to save someone's life....I AM! As for your comment that I need to get off &quot;my high horse&quot; ABSOLUTELY NOT! I make no apologies for my level of dedication, commitment &amp; professionalism. Comments like yours clearly illustrate the fact that too few people have an understanding of all I &amp; my fellow nurses do. It is time nurses stand up and are counted! We deserve and demand respect, especially from an institution that will publicly take credit for the excellent care I provide then turn around and try to cut my legs out from under me. The time for silence is OVER!

jcj

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:30 p.m.

a2zoo WHERE did I mention anything about cutting anyone's benefits? I merely pointed out that everyone thinks THEY are the important ones!

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:07 p.m.

JCJ, exactly, I do not want your benefits cut, so why would you want mine cut???

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:01 p.m.

So John B. you are saying that all the nurses do 5-7 year residencies and 1-2 year fellowships AFTER undergrad and nursing school? You are right then, with all that training they should be paid as much as their MD counterparts!

jcj

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:52 p.m.

BTW Most regular people I know prefer the personal care they get at Chelsea better than St Joe or The U!

jcj

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:49 p.m.

John B How long have you been a nurse? Did I whine about overpaid medical providers? Pay attention! Or read again! What I took issue with was the highlandlass1592 comment that if it weren't for nurses like &quot;HERSELF&quot;. She was not bashful about tooting her horn. As if she was what made the difference. I contend there are lots of people there that make the difference. @ a2zoo I said that there were lots of people at the hospital that make it &quot;a world-class institution. &quot; So whats your point? You just backed up what I said!

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:33 p.m.

Again, I think we are all important. So, jcj, what is your point? What are you talking about?

John B.

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:42 p.m.

That would be 'horse' and if you think that having a top-quality nursing staff isn't the key to running a top-quality hospital, you must have no experience with hospitals, so you just spout off without thinking. Nurses are the most over-worked and under-appreciated members of the medical provider community. If you want to whine about overpaid medical providers, look no further than the specialist MDs. Way overpaid, in my opinion. Not as bad as hedge fund managers or members of Congress, but pretty high up on the list, as far as I am concerned.

Joe Payer

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:41 p.m.

I am proud of the of The Nurses at U of M ! People who dont stand up for themselves will be taken advantage of. The company I workfor went thru a similar issue and instead of cutting from the top they cut from the the little people. Guess what ? NO one wants to stay longer than the time to find a higher paying JOB. The UFCW failed their job, maybe MNA will have more luck than we did. All I can say is the moral is gone and so are the good workers. If Michigan doesnt stand up with their unions than soon all these employers will turn into Walmart!

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:31 p.m.

Jack, are you always so childish? Many of the nurses that were not there, were working, taking care of patients. Wake up!!!!

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:46 p.m.

How many of those nurses skipped the rally so they could go shopping at Walmart and Costco?

Michigander74

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:41 p.m.

I also pay about 20% of my healthcare costs and have just gotten my first raise in 3 years (2.5%, doesn't even cover the cost of living increases that happened over these years). It's the reality of the current US economy, especially here in Michigan. I do cringe when people credit themselves with being the &quot;Michigan Difference&quot; when I know that so many people get incredibly awful care at UMHS, I wouldn't take credit for that myself.

Dennis

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:03 a.m.

They are makig money. 2% is projected on a 2 billion dollar budget. And mgt got between 3 and 10 % increases. With some getting raises of 50000 in one year without any consessions. I know things are tough, but that does not mean that the rich should get more off the backs of labor. The middle class continues to support the rich and get less for doing it.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:14 a.m.

Did management get between 6 and 20% wage increases? Is mangement working 16 hours a day at the bedside where you work?

ViSHa

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:59 p.m.

So Michael Long, you are saying EVERY nurse at UM is outstanding? And no one would or could complain about the care they may have received from a nurse? Okay.

Michael Long

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:51 p.m.

Don't confuse physician care with nursing care. Decisions as to what medications are prescribed, when and which surgeries are preformed, when patients are discharged, all lie with the PHYSICIANS. I had many patients who were dissatisfied with the physicians who still thought the nurses were outstanding. So, the next time someone says &quot;I wouldn't go back to UM,&quot; go ahead and ask them for details. I doubt that the nurses will be the reason.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:30 p.m.

Give me a break. As so many have pointed out, there are many other medical institutions in the area, why do you keep coming back for the &quot;awful&quot; care you get at the UMHS?

cm

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 8:44 p.m.

That's a lot of blabber. Give details or go away.

Reason

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:23 p.m.

I'm still frustrated about the lack of reporting details. The article states: &quot;neither the nurses union its employer has provided details on the details of the contract dispute.&quot; So as a journalist you say: oh, ok, never mind then? Heck no. You interview nurses and try to get the details from them, you talk to people from the administration off the record and try to get details anonymously. The nurses want &quot;no changes&quot; but you haven't told us much of anything about what the current situation is compared to other similar institutions!

Michigan Man

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:17 p.m.

Your previous article suggested that 1000's would attend and now the figure in this article is downsized to 100's = not that good a turn out on a warm, enjoyable Michigan week-end day. If I were the U of M nurses I would worry that their overall number is soon to be downsized by the U of M.

Dennis

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:55 a.m.

You did not get the point. which is not suprising by the attitude of what you write. What was meant is that if the Follow through with all of the demands on the nurses many high quality RN who travel a long way will no longer do so if they are no longer competative with other institutions that are closer to their homes. St joes is a great hospital, and I am not suprised that you get good care there. Many of thei nurses make more than those at the U,and while they do not double retirement they just match it. They get a pension as well as the retirement plan.

Michigan Man

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:41 a.m.

Looked at the pictures again and saw many, many angry women. Hating on the U of M seemed in vogue in Ann Arbor today? Always a solid move to bite the hand that feeds you!

cm

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:24 a.m.

Sorry we missed you today Stevie. There was close to 2000 people today. I am glad you have received fine healthcare at St. Joes. Too bad you have to go there so often. Why don't you come over here where we can probably fix you in one visit? Cheers.

Michigan Man

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:57 p.m.

Sorry to disappoint my friends on this page but I have received fine, fine healthcare in Ann Arbor many, many times, especially at St. Joe. This page seems to have many U of M nurses hating on their employer. Finally, we now have one RN commenting that those who are on the other side of this issue may be subject to deliberate, willful low quality care - SHOCKING - I thought the nursing profession was professional. To this author, please use your real name next time so that I may report you to hospital administration.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:27 p.m.

Don't worry little Stephen, we will take care of you, your family, your kids, your parents, your friends. You willl be treated with respect, even if you do not earn it.

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:17 p.m.

Stephen.. god help you if you or one of your friends or relatives (God forbid your children) ever need medical assistance if this is how you think!

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:49 p.m.

Mr Hankamp, you are all over these Nursing union stories, talking about how &quot;fatigued&quot; you are over the whole thing. Yet, you seem to have some type of a vested interest in the nurses being unable to obtain a fair contract. Why???? If you are so tired of it leave it alone. Or do you another agenda??

sarah

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:44 p.m.

Actually Stephen, U of M will be hiring more nurses and definitely not &quot;downsizing&quot; with the opening of the new Women's and Children's Hospital.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:42 p.m.

There was a lot more then 1000 nurses today. There would have been many more, except another thousand or so were inside, doing their jobs, taking care of patients.

highlandlass1592

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:13 p.m.

As a nurse at the University of Michigan, I came to this facility to join a world-class institution that provides top-notch care to its patients. Unfortunately, the administration doesn't seem to value the idea that I AM their &quot;Michigan Difference&quot;. If it wasn't for nurses like myself, this hospital would not be able to continue to be considered a world-class institution. Let's look at some facts: this facility isn't operating in the red, in fact they are looking to increase their profit margin at my family's expense. I already pay over 20% of my health care costs. I make less than fellow nurses at other local facilities and as my years of experience increase (which allows me to provide care to our patients that no other local facility can) I am NOT eligible for even a cost of living increase. If I'm lucky and the administration is feeling gracious, I may be able to get a 1% wage increase. Asking me to increase my contributions for my own healthcare to the point suggested means I'm taking even more of pay cut than I already am! The CEO of this hospital was given a substantial raise in addition to other perks. His raise alone could have paid for quite a few nurses' salaries. My cost to park at the hospital have substantially increased as well. I live an hour away...I choose to come to this facility because of what I can do here as a nurse..I am PROUD of the care I deliver on a daily basis! Why should my family have to suffer, why should I have to work two jobs just to make ends meet when this hospital and its administrators live in the lap of luxury? If pain must be felt, our &quot;leaders&quot; should lead by example and take a pay cut first!

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 5:22 a.m.

The point she is making is that the admin is grossly overpaid. It has everything to do with it because there is no proof any of these people possess skills that an individual that was paid much less possess. It's a runaway train in the public sector. It seems the pay is based on twisted thinking that if you pay someone an extravagant salary, your overall rating will be boosted. Alternatively, in countries that have single payer systems you do not see salaries this big. In England there is one administrator who earned £270,000 ($439,633), far less than UM's Ora Pescovitz who started in 2009 at $$700,000, with the ability to earn up to $150,000 annually if she meets certain performance goals. So the pay for one administrator at UM is almost double the pay of an administrator in England responsible for health care for a significant portion of the whole country. England, by the way is approximately the same size as the state of Michigan with a population of 61 million. I would say health care officials in the US are overpaid. What I would like to know is what are the other local facilities that pay nurses more? I am not aware of that, UM nurses are well paid and I am not aware of any other local hospital that pays much more. And if that is true, why do you commute an hour away when you can make more at one of those hospitals?

j5

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 3:46 a.m.

I don't get why when making your argument you point to the compensation of the CEO like it has anything to do with this. Your pay is a cost line item that gets figured into the cost of health care. Wages aren't some fixed pie that gets divided amongst employees. The CEO could make minimum wage and it still wouldn't change the dynamics which determine the demand curve for the product of your labor. You are just offering up a typical class warfare myth. It's horribly ignorant at best and deliberately dishonest at worst.

glacialerratic

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:12 p.m.

&quot;Aetna C.E.O. Ronald Williams has helped purge millions of members from the company's rolls; his total annual compensation in 2008 was $24,300,112. Angela Braly, who has promised that WellPoint "will not sacrifice profitability," also saw a raise, to $9,844,212. Cigna's Edward Hanway saw his pay cut in half and still hauled in $12,236,740, but he was forced to manage a major P.R. crisis after the company initially refused to approve a liver transplant for a 17-year-old girl, which it said was "outside the scope of the plan's coverage." She died just hours after Cigna changed its mind and decided it would pay for a new liver after all. Despite a 75 percent pay drop in 2008, cutting him down to a humiliating $3,241,042, UnitedHealth Group's Stephen Hemsley put on a brave face for Congress, assuring legislators: "Our mission at UnitedHealth Group is to help people live healthier lives." UnitedHealth has been fined tens of millions of dollars for claims-processing violations (i.e., stiffing patients and doctors). Hemsley's predecessor, William McGuire, resigned amid a stock-options backdating scandal in 2006. He still walked away with nearly half a billion dollars in stock options. Hemsley surrendered $190 million in options himself, but with $744,232,068 left over, he should be fine.&quot; Matt Kapp, &quot;The Sick Business of Health-Care Profiteering,&quot; Vanity Fair, September 24, 2009 Yeah, there go those darn profiteering nurses, responsible for spiraling health care costs...

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:29 p.m.

Wow Jack, that's pretty hard to deflect.

sarah

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:08 p.m.

@Marilyn Wilkie- Just because &quot;everyone else&quot; is doing it, doesn't make it right.

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 4:41 a.m.

I agree with Sarah though I would not use &quot;right.&quot; I like appropriate. A union can take it or leave it. Fine. But if a union holds fast and refuses to agree to cuts, a common result is layoffs. That is really a compromise decision. Then the union will claim the service is unsafe due to insufficient numbers. AAPD and AAFD claim this and the city denies it. I think in local govts and public sector services, the state should set minimum staffing levels that must be maintained by law. Unions eat their young.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:26 a.m.

Again maybe everyone else should have stood up and said NO!!!!!!!

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:19 p.m.

Jack...obviously you followed the guy who jumped off the cliff!

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:14 p.m.

YES !!!! exactly Sara!! :)

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:22 p.m.

Mom: If all of your friends were being nurses, would you be a nurse too?

Meg

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:07 p.m.

Gooooo nurses! You have my full support!

Meg

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:53 p.m.

I'm a taxpayer and a patient of UMHS. There is no better use my insurance payments or my tax money can be put to than ensuring we have a stable, fairly-compensated nursing staff. Nursing care saves lives. The next time you're in the hospital, think about why you wanted these men and women to take an effective pay cut while admin gets bonuses.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:50 p.m.

No Mr. Gladney, we will be paying our own. It is just not going to be at the rate the hospital is demanding.

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:11 p.m.

&quot;Full support&quot; :D One can assume that means you will be helping then with their co-pay, correct?

Marilyn Wilkie

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 6:58 p.m.

Everyone else in the Health System is paying more for their healthcare, why not them?

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 4:34 a.m.

Jerome your video is propaganda. Heard it before, its the same old complaint that the wealthy do not pay enough. Nobody is trying to divide the middle class. And IMHO the problem is not more taxes, it is what they will be spent on. I do not trust this administration on spending.

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:58 a.m.

We can all just become missionaries and work for free

Dennis

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:42 a.m.

That is not true. they have a system and some of the unions pay less based on income level. But someone that makes 53,000 a year pays as much as the ceos that got 10 % increase in pay that make over 500,000 per year. and there are two groups that make less than 53000 per year that pay less. so why should nurses get an increase that does not cover the increased cost while the ceo's got 50000 grand a year increases.

proudnurse

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:02 a.m.

Because they didn't fight for themselves!! Don't blame us for fighting for what is fair!!

beersnob

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 1:24 a.m.

I don't think the nurse is complaining about working 12 hours. The issue is being mandated to stay and work an additional 4 hours so the total of your shift would be 16 hours...... That is a very long time to be at work, and as an added slap in the face she wont get over time?

extrememoderate

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 12:21 a.m.

According to what I read from Ann Arbor.com there was a nurse from a Chicago hospital who spoke at the rally that there nurses just went through this and won with a 1300 person workforce and simular issues. Did you hear about this?

Michigan Man

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 10:03 p.m.

One of your posters is complaining about a 12 hour shift. If she does not like this she can leave the U of M system and seek employment elsewhere. Please do not move to Chicago where I currently live. I would not want her to be involved in the provision of my care.

Michael Long

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:56 p.m.

Unlike the other hospitals in Michigan, the increases in healthcare costs AND wage freezes are being brought down from the legislature, since UMHS is affiliated with the university, making every UMHS employee subject to the same cuts as all other state employees. Not to mention, the wages at UMHS are lower than just about every other hospital in the area.

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:27 p.m.

So your fine with upper mangement double digit raises as long as the nurses of the hospital cover the gap and then some? What's wrong with shared sacrifice? Nice morale building UofM. You can't have it both ways.

klarck

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:16 p.m.

&quot;Everyone else in the Health System is paying more for their healthcare, why not them?&quot; Perhaps the nurses don't want to join everyone else in a race to the bottom. Perhaps the nurses think those who with 6 and 7 figure salaries getting double-digit raises should be the ones paying more for healthcare. Perhaps the nurses don't think budgets should be balanced on the backs of &quot;fatcat&quot; teachers, &quot;fatcat&quot; policemen, &quot;fatcat&quot; firefighters and &quot;fatcat&quot; nurses. Perhaps the nurses believe the average worker in SE Michigan is tightening their belts simply to keep the rich rich.

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:13 p.m.

Talk to a &quot;real&quot; person Marilyn who actually knows what they are talking about! Examples are...After I work my 12 hour shift..they can mandate me to stay another 4 hours and NOT HAVE TO PAY ME OVERTIME???? Would you be comfortable with me taking care of your child that night??? Oh thats right...I'm a compassionate person..I should just do it for free..

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:38 p.m.

So what!!! They are completely different issues. The rest of the hospital should not be paying more either!!!!!

Jerome

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:21 p.m.

The Middle Class has been divided. Which is all a part of the grand scheme. Please check out this video: <a href="http://pol.moveon.org/reichvideo4/?id=28028-3394676-CLLVHCx&t=1" rel='nofollow'>http://pol.moveon.org/reichvideo4/?id=28028-3394676-CLLVHCx&amp;t=1</a> . Please watch the video at about 1 minute, 45 seconds into the video, to see how we are all being pitted against one another, as the uber-wealthy rake in all the benefits.

highlandlass1592

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:15 p.m.

everyone else isn't necessairly paying more...and many of the other staffers are elgible for pay raises. Nurses aren't being offered the same perks. I already pay a substantial portion of my health care benefits, why do I have to bleed more for a facility that isn't losing money? They CAN afford to pay me a decent wage but choose not to.

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 6:57 p.m.

Are these healthcare profiteers being asked for 'cuts' in benefits or are they being asked to contribute to the cost of their own consumption like everyone else in the real world? Wah, wah wah!!!

Mick52

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 4:28 a.m.

Jack's point is a common one and it is true that in many occupations, employees are being asked to pay a higher portion of their premiums. But just because it is proper to do that in some areas, that does not mean it is appropriate in all areas. Another trend is the explosion of executive pay. Public sector execs have been arguing that they can make more in the private sector. My answer to that is, fine go work in the private sector because very few, if any are worth what they are paid. If the high paid execs at UMMC are so brilliant they deserve these high pay checks, why do they have fiscal problems that cause them to ask people at the lower end of the pay scales to take cuts in overall compensation? The compensation at the upper levels is more out of hand than at the lower levels. When you have that, there is a ripple effect. The higher ups will surround themselves with high paid aids and as you descend in levels of employees if those gaps are wide you are not going to get lower paid employees to give up their pay and benefits. This is a huge slap in the face for not only nurses, but all of the employees at the lower pay grades, especially at a time when the high cost of health care is such a huge national issue. And at a time when taxes, fees and the cost of living can spike at any time now due to an unstable economy. If the hospital (and the entire UM) wants cuts from employees, they should lead by example.

Dennis

Sun, Aug 14, 2011 : 2:33 a.m.

I am happy to see you crying as you seem to deserve to. The nurses do contribute, but if all of these cuts happen to their wages they will be unable to contribute to the economy as much as they do now.

thegatekeeper

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 11:45 p.m.

Good sir..we definitely don't profit and we do contribute to our benefits. I make a salary that I am happy about that is directly proportional to my education, experience as well as the amount of bodily fluids, verbal abuse from patients and back pain I deal with every day I go to work. I do think that it is fair to ask us to contribute a little more to our health insurance benefits as fitting with the current economic climate, but the other concessions, such as increasing nurse/patient ratios, which may be economically feasible, are unacceptable in order to provide safe care and a pleasant working environment.

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 11:32 p.m.

A2zoo and RN I am jealous of no one and was not dealt a bad hand. I have made life choices to best suit the the needs of my family and the values my spouse and I want them to grow up with (Not thinking &quot;me me me&quot;.) Sling away with your vitriol.

extrememoderate

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:41 p.m.

Sorry Jack that life may have delt you a bad hand, but I'm amazed that you let the top tier people get a pass on this issue.

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:23 p.m.

My point Jack, and you just made it for me, is that you are just jealous that you cannot fight corporate greed. Sorry about that, but we can!! We will win this fight and if people like you joined us instead of fighting us, maybe you would win a few too. We are together, we do deserve what we have, we are willing to fight to keep it, and we will win!!!!!

RN

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 9:08 p.m.

Whatever Jack! Pull your head outta the sand and find out the &quot;real&quot; details before you talk trash about us! Its people like you who are JEALOUS !!!!! Wah wah wah!!!!!

Jack Gladney

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:40 p.m.

a2zoo Yep. Been doing that for about three years to keep my family fed and a roof over their heads. And your point is?.....

a2zoo

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:37 p.m.

Yes, and I am sure that you gladly agree to work more for less pay everyday, don't you?

Jerome

Sat, Aug 13, 2011 : 7:18 p.m.

The Middle Class has been divided. Which is all a part of the grand scheme. Please check out this video: <a href="http://pol.moveon.org/reichvideo4/?id=28028-3394676-CLLVHCx&t=1" rel='nofollow'>http://pol.moveon.org/reichvideo4/?id=28028-3394676-CLLVHCx&amp;t=1</a> . Please watch the video at about 1 minute, 45 seconds into the video, to see how we are all being pitted against one another, as the uber-wealthy rake in all the benefits.

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