Posted on Sun, Jun 9, 2013 : 5:08 p.m.
Rep. Jeff Irwin gives update on state's budget and curriculum changes for schools
By Ryan J. Stanton
State Rep. Jeff Irwin, D-Ann Arbor, gave a brief update on the latest happenings in Lansing at a forum hosted by the Ann Arbor Democratic Party on Saturday.
Irwin, with 22-month-old son Mackinac in tow, talked about the state's budget and increasing sales tax revenues being witnessed in Michigan, which he said made the budget process a lot easier this year. He also discussed curriculum changes and other issues facing schools.
Ryan J. Stanton covers government and politics for AnnArbor.com. Reach him at ryanstanton@annarbor.com or 734-623-2529. You also can follow him on Twitter or subscribe to AnnArbor.com's email newsletters.
Comments
Nicholas Urfe
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 12:59 p.m.
This talk about welding vs algebra ignores the most important part of lower education: teaching kids to *think* and how to teach themselves. Public schools today tend to emphasize compliance and being a good little drone. Don't question anything, follow. Never before in history have individuals of all ages had access to so many learning resources via the internet. But without the drive and passion to self-educate, what have they been taught? Some people insist upon being spoon-fed information. They lack the initiative to get online and simply look something up. Those people are doomed.
Mike
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 8:33 p.m.
nicholas - you make the best point I have seen to date. If you teach kids to think and then want to learn, the sky is the limit for them. I love to learn and am a life time learner, but I pursue things that I love to do and am very good at. We shove so much worthless stuff down the throats of our children and wonder why so many fail. We have achievement gaps and the academics try to solve them by making the curriculum tougher and filling it with more useless stuff. Quantity vs. quality of education seems to be their answer. They are usually people who are very good at school but not able to bring it down to the level of the learner.
Nicholas Urfe
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 3:45 p.m.
FYI, a good friend has taught high school math for the past 10 years. Other friends are educators in the a2 school system. And then there are my kids. Additionally, we have the publicly stated mission of teaching to the test, and the emphasis on mandated k-12 performance testing. So I stand by my points and my sources.
ThinkingOne
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 3:28 p.m.
'Public schools today tend to emphasize compliance and being a good little drone. Don't question anything, follow.' And some people tend to emphasize broad generalities. Your previous post admits that your experience with algebra - and then theoretically schooling - is 'dated'. Perhaps you should visit some schools and see how they are structured today.
Ivor Ivorsen
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 2:43 p.m.
"Public schools today tend to emphasize compliance and being a good little drone. Don't question anything, follow." Wow! that sounds terrible...got any examples by chance? School? District? Curriculum? Textbook? Lesson plan?
Nicholas Urfe
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 12:55 p.m.
@Ivor: "Shipyards?!? Does Rep. Ed. McBroom (R) believe we are building Liberty Ships somewhere in Michigan?" Don't get caught up in the details of the story - it is an excellent point. There is huge demand for welders in the oil industry, and elsewhere. Very, very few people will ever apply the algebra they were tested on in school - even "computer programmers" (a very small subset of software engineers use algebra, let alone higher math). Notice I don't say "learned". Most algebra is poorly taught, with little emphasis on real world problems (in my dated experience). The problem I have is students aren't allowed to do both. My high school had amazing vocational courses in trades, but that was not the "college" path and it meant missing other key courses.
mgoscottie
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 9:53 a.m.
People that use rigorous to describe education in a positive manner should get out of education.....
Mike
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 3:16 a.m.
One size does not fit all but it looks like you think we should all be the same. What good is foreign language for our auto mechanics, construction people, and other vocations that do not require you to speak a foreign language? How about making those who immigrate to this country learn to speak English? I don't understand how making the ciriculum more rigorous when we have such a high failure rate and can't teach the subject matter we already have is going to help.
Mike
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 8:26 p.m.
Veracity - the answer is always more money. And if and American would like to work overseas there are programs like Rosetta Stone that you can learn from. Requiring all students to take a language which many fail miserably and wreck their GPA with seems counterproductive when so many are failing. Who decided that foreign languages were the answers to what ails this country?
Veracity
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 12:52 p.m.
You identify a significant problem, Mike, and more attention and money needs to be applied to fixing our broken education system, and especially starting at the preschool level. As for learning a foreign language, I am sure that the ability to converse in Chinese will help some Americans to gain employment.
Huron74
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 2:24 a.m.
If an employer needs something welded Ivor and an applicant with a HS or CC certificate in welding applies, this would go a LONG WAY toward a positive hiring decision for them. The inexperienced HS grad who got a B- in Algebra ll or an A- in French, not so much. The way i see the world going is that soon the only people in the future who will have steady, paid, employment will be those who can't be outsourced to Third World, out sourced to immigrants places or who can't be automated out of existence. To me that means people who know how to do things, not just who "know stuff".
Veracity
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 12:49 p.m.
I am sure that some robots do welding now and will become common as technology advances. The "brain" is the last human facility that a robot will replace but it will happen too, unfortunately.
Ivor Ivorsen
Sun, Jun 9, 2013 : 11:39 p.m.
(From the linked MLive article) "Are we really going to say you need to get into Algebra II and learn about imaginary numbers instead of getting into that welding class so you can go down to the shipyard and get a job after you graduate?" McBroom said. Shipyards?!? Does Rep. Ed. McBroom (R) believe we are building Liberty Ships somewhere in Michigan? As for Algebra, it is clear from his statement that he doesn't have the foggiest notion what an imaginary number is, or how knowledge of that concept might be just a tad more useful in the 21st century global economy than welding in an "imaginary " shipyard.
AMOC
Mon, Jun 10, 2013 : 3:41 p.m.
Ivor - There are a couple of working shipyards and a few more boatyards in Michigan, especially in the UP. But Rep Irwin is quite wrong if he thinks Algebra isn't important to ship builders or welders. They need to be able to do Algebra, Geometry and Trigonometry in order to do the complex setups of hull lines correctly.
Dog Guy
Sun, Jun 9, 2013 : 9:57 p.m.
Mackinac is a very fine name for a guy: snapping turtle, Manitou's island home treasured by both Yoopers and Trolls. And Mackinac Irwin has a lifelong duty of teaching the correct pronunciation. It's a tough job, Mack, but somebody has to do it.
Ryan J. Stanton
Sun, Jun 9, 2013 : 10:50 p.m.
I like the name, too. And he does have Yooper in his blood, since Jeff is from Sault Ste. Marie.