3 And Out

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 11:10 a.m.

PS Robbie...how many NCs has the great offensive mind Rich Rod won? 0 but he has had 6 losing seasons out of 17 as a head coach...wow that is a lot isnt it? not a good ratio of losing for such a genius to have....

3 And Out

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 11:02 a.m.

Really Robbie Scooter....your argument appears to be that the reason that the Big Ten has only won 2 NCs since 1968 is due to the lack of offenses.... yet the reality is that the 2 that they did win (1997 and 2002 OSU) were with 2 of the weakest offensive teams that either of these schools had in years. The explosive Michigan teams of the late 90s/early 00s... late 80s to early 90s etc. didnt sniff NCs and they were VERY explosive teams filled with tons of offensive talent that produced in college and went on to star in the NFL. OSU has a similar track record of years of great offense which they did not win NCs.... But you maintain that the lack of offense is the reason for only 2 NCs? Dont you see the illogic in your logic? Are you purposedly being Obtuse? One big reason why the Big Ten has few NCs since 68 is the fact that prior to the mid 00s, Michigan and OSU knocked each other out on about an every other year basis... and Michigan played ND a lot when ND was good, knocking Michigan out some years etc.... but isnt it interesting that prior to the Rich Rod Error...the 2 winningist programs since 1970 in College football overall were: 1 Michigan 2 OSU those are the facts jack.

willievrine

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 9:31 a.m.

Im A Michigan Apologist (Sung to the tune of Yankee Doodle Dandy) Im a Michigan apol-o-gist, Maize and Blue do or die, A real live nephew of my Uncle Bo, Go Blue, is my battle cry. Im a Michigan apol-o-gist, Coach Rod will take us all the way, The Wolverines went to Columbus, Just to beat the Buckeyes, I am a UM kinda guy. George M. Cohan/James Cagney/Willievrine 2010

willievrine

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 9:24 a.m.

Regardless what the polls say (good or bad) Im 100% behind Coach Rodriguez and the Michigan Wolverines. Queme los Trolles!

gatling64

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 9:02 a.m.

ROBBIE WEBB this rebuilding era has bee good for UM fans who are finding out how the half lives.This is RRs third year and he had half the team quit because they realized the good old days were gone. Every player who quit was LCs recruit.RR for all the venom sputed has not lost a single player that he brougt in (except Feagin) And the current players are recruiting for RR.J T Turner,the #2 db in the nation but one who is not expected to start,is going all out to recruit a couple of kids from his HS Massilon,OH. To change coaches at this time would be rediculous.RR is at the beginning of building a NC type team.He had to change virtually the entire roster to get the type of team he wanted and now he has it.We should expect a big improvement and if we get it,nexy years recruiting class will be in the top 5, and we will be able to compete with anyone.

TokyoWolverine

Tue, Jun 8, 2010 : 1:03 a.m.

Michael Rothstein and AA.com staff, what was the logic in choosing the title for this article? I realize that your title does not say "majority" (of people are negative), but the poll clearly shows people are undecided. You could have easily chosen to say "Polling website says Michigan fans are undecided about football coach Rich Rodriguez". You are sacrificing integrity to increase page views/clicks by fanning negativity. It is disgusting and clearly shows that you care more about fast results vs making your paper more credible by delivering unbiased reporting. How long do you think this strategy will work before AA.com falls the way of your paper and becomes a trivial blog.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 11:23 p.m.

I encourage you to keep commenting 3 and out, you are making me look better with each post. Keep 'em coming!

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 11:19 p.m.

If you read again, I never was praising the offfense in 97'. I was doing the exact opposite.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 11:17 p.m.

3 and out, what are you talking about? How am I clueless? Do the math, the big ten prides themselves on running the football and since 1970 the big ten as a whole has won three national championships. Now tell me if that's successfull. Defense wins championships, but you must alsot score. Might I suggest football 101?

3 And Out

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 10:25 p.m.

"but the old Michigan offense is precisely why Michigan's only championship in the last 50+ years was in 1997." Wow Scooter. What a statement to make. Clearly you are clueless as to football. The fact that the 97 team had one of the weaker offenses in recent Michigan football history adds to the fact that you are completely clueless. But...if your glorified OC Rich Rod being HC makes you feel that you are entitled to such statements...well go for it...the rest of us will just sit back and laugh. Ha. Ha.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 8:49 p.m.

I respect that answer, and I know what streaks Michigan had in terms of winning and going to bowl games, but the old Michigan offense is precisely why Michigan's only championship in the last 50+ years was in 1997. Michigan by history has had an excellent defense, that was never really the issue. Something needed to change, and that change was the offense, we were in desperate need of speed. We haven't even won the rose bowl in a long time, and the type of offense we ran against Florida in 2008 was the spread. But like I have said before, if you look at what happens when key players are missing for whatever reason, bad things are bound to happen. Which is why Michigan lost to App. State and Oregon. Henne and Hart played, but they were injured. And that was Carr's team that would go on to beat Florida later on. And when Rich Rod got in, guys like Henne, Hart, and Long all graduated. Those are HUGE losses alone on the offense, and Brandon Minor never was completely healthy for his time there, and the new offense and Carr's departure was just the exuse Mallett needed to leave. And Rod was left with a heck of alot of issues to deal with. As far as the defense is concerned, they should be much improved compared to last year. Brandon Minor will be missed, but the line wont suffer much, as we have Mike Martin, Van-Bergan, Greg Banks, and Big Will to help out. Roh, Mouton, and Ezeh should be good at linebacker, and the secodary should improve from last year based on basically everyone but Warren coming back. We're still Michigan, and we wont be down for long. I have great faith this team can really do well this season. And that alone will lift a huge weight off the shoulders off the team and fans.

Jaxon5

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 8:31 p.m.

I never said he was a bad coach. I would say his record has not demonstrated he was a great coach. I would also say he was allowed to dismantle the program to do what he thought was right. The problem was - he was not right. He was allowed to throw out everything that worked, without regard to keeping the winning tradition going. To keep a team on a winning track, a great coach works through a transition plan that addresses all of the usual transition issues. A great coach keeps the team on track. So, I don't think the record, and by that I mean all of the actions taken as well as the won loss record, demonstrated a great coaching job. He may in fact be a great coach, but that has not been demonstrated yet.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 8:04 p.m.

I know what the record is, I want evidence how it's the coaches fault. The record is because of issues to the players on the team. Any coach would have stuggled with what was at hand. Any coach. So let me ask again, what evidence do you have to prove that Rodriguez is a bad coach? What's going to be your excuse if the team does really well? What will you have to say if Michigan beats Uconn? Are you still going to have a poor attitude toward the team? If I were new on this site, I would never guess you're a Michigan fan.

Jaxon5

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 7:54 p.m.

All the evidence has been presented during the first two seasons. The evidence is clear. Year 1: 3-9. Year 2: 4-7. (D State doesn not count). Years 1-2: Only 3 Big Ten wins vs. 13 losses. The evidence is overwhelming.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 7:48 p.m.

And what leads you to assume and what facts do you have to think that there will never be consistent good years? Why would you even say that? Jaxon, the Rich Rod supporters who know what's going on have provided facts and presented evidence to support those facts, and the Rich Rod haters have not made on valid point yet. The ONLY thing that the Rich Rod haters do is point the finger and do it over and over again.

Robbie Webb

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 7:44 p.m.

Jaxon...what kind of a statement is that? The cupboard being bare is not the coaches fault. Most of them graduated, and don't even mention Ryan Mallett, you and I both know he was on transfer notice long before Rodriguez even got there. And scroll up and read the Brandon Graham article about what kind of person and coach Rodriguez is. Players being young is not the coaches fault.

Jaxon5

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 7:14 p.m.

If the cupboard was truly bare, and let's assume that's a fact, then who's fault is it? The coaching staff's fault, that's whose fault it is. They pretty much ran off the talent so they could run their own "system". As a result, they've "systematically" destroyed this football team, or at best, they've made it like every other team out there. Nothing distinctive about it. Just mediocre, if not downright bad. U Mich is now subject to the rebuilding cycles that all mediocre teams face. There will be up years and down years, but there will be no consistently good or great years like we used to see in Ann Arbor. Those days are over. Systematic elimination.

truebluefan

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 2:01 p.m.

wvtroll - These three links are excellent summaries of the facts and background behind Michigan's defensive attrition issues. Adam Rittenberg from ESPN has linked to these blog posts in his columns. It is highly recommended reading for the anti-RR crowd. mgoblog.com/diaries/decimated-defense mgoblog.com/diaries/decimated-defense-part-ii-statisticating mgoblog.com/diaries/decimated-defense-part-iii-resuscitating

wvtroll

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 11:45 a.m.

TrueBlue, If you're happy with how your coach has performed, then that's all that matters. I keep hearing about this bareness, and I'm sure you can tell I'm not from around those parts so I really don't know, but could anyone point me to a tally of what was really available for RR when he arrived as far as returning players, recruits arriving, etc.?

truebluefan

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 11:34 a.m.

VT has always had an outstanding defense to fall back upon. Did VT have defensive attrition like Michigan experienced? No way. And RB is typically the easiest spot on the team for a freshman to excel, especially if your O line has a decent amount of experience. Michigan's "bare cupboard" is not an excuse, it is a well documented and researched FACT. It is my belief that any coach would've had similar problems as Rich. Apparently Mr. Brandon feels the same way. Bottom line, and I think what Robbie, myself and many others on this board are saying is, yes, Rich Rodriguez has done a good job of developing and using the personnel on his team.

wvtroll

Mon, Jun 7, 2010 : 6:42 a.m.

Rob Webb, This is not about VT, but some of their out-of-conference games included a #5 Alabama opener, and a second game #2 LSU, along with no less than 4 top-25 teams in their regular seasons for the past few years. Now lets see what UM has for some of it's out-of-conference games or creampuffs: App State, Toledo, UConn, Mass, Bowling Green, W. Mich, E Mich, and so on. All teams play marshmallow games at some point. My message was to be that the coach MUST use what he has available to the best of his abilities. Injuries happen every year, seniors and juniors leave due to graduation and the draft. All coaches are faced with this problem. YOU must decide if YOUR coach has used his personnel in the best way. It's one thing to have great recruiting, it's another thing to use those recruits to better the team. Many coaches have gotten freshmen that step up the first year and contribute, but the coach has to make sure they're ready. That's what Beamer did when he lost his star running back (two years in a row) and so many departed the team. Bare cupboards is a totally useless arguement when it comes to playing creampuffs, as that just puts you on a level playing field for those games, and it should never be an arguement in any situation as an excuse for poor overall results such as UM has had for two years.

truebluefan

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 10:24 p.m.

Robbie - Great points, especially the point about the 2007 team losing those games because of a few key players being injured. Upper class leadership being healthy and on the field is so important to success. It's ok to start a few freshmen or sophomores as long as you have the upper classmen in there as well. Michigan under RR has not had that luxury to this point. We'll have a few upper class guys this season but not enough. Next season will be the first year in the RR regime that we'll have the older leaders on both sides of the ball.

Robbie Webb

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 9:21 p.m.

3 and out, I said Purdue. If I put Iowa, I ment Purdue. Either way, they put points up there as well, again, not the offenses fault. Still waiting for those facts that disproves my argument.

RobbiesBoyfriend

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 7:13 p.m.

That was my fault 3andout! Robbie is very thoughtful when checking his facts, im clumsy sometimes. Sorry

3 And Out

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 6:43 p.m.

you are lying Robbie...in a different thread you stated that Michigan's offense scored 36 vs Iowa last year and I called you on it and you admitted you were wrong...you are still wrong and you know it...get your facts straight son

RobbiesBoyfriend

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 6:02 p.m.

Anyways Ryan Mallet wasnt the best QB for michigan, and he was gonna transfer no matter what. RR is not at fault for mallets transfer, he was gone no matter what. Check your facts, only reply if you can provide factual information regarding your arguments!

Robbie Webb

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 4:42 p.m.

Both Henne and Mallett played, and with our team that got blown out by Oregon and lost to App. State, injuries was the factor that year, and that was with the team that would go on to beat Florida, with the spread I might add. So if injuries that particular year had an effect to where we lost to App. State, then why are you surprised when youth, key INJURIES, walkons at key spots, and very little veteran leadership and experience all at the same time produced an 8-16 record? HOW is that the coaches fault? How? I want someone to answer that. If injuries to players like Henne and Hart affected the team to lose those first two games and only score 3 points against OSU with alot of experience at the other positions, then how is it all of a sudden coach Rod's fault that those experienced guys graduated and was left with alot of youth and then we struggled the past two years?

Robbie Webb

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 4:21 p.m.

Check your facts again, he did play against Oregon, and I never said they scored 36 on Iowa, I said Purdue. And they were third best in scoring in overall gameplay, 9th in the big ten. My facts are straight. You have yet to prove me wrong. And if it's a weak argument, then why haven't you proved me wrong yet or answered any of my questions?

3 And Out

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 3:39 p.m.

ha ha aha! Mallet didnt start or play in those 2 games..whew...where are you coming from Robbie? maybe you are just a support troll who is really a fan of another school and would love for RR to stay... anyway..if you are not then you need to check your facts and history... you also stated that Michigan scored 36 last year vs. Iowa and had the 3rd best offense in the Big Ten..uh huh...that kind of irresponsible fact fabricating undermines your whole argument, as weak as it is.

Robbie Webb

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 11:39 a.m.

Hmm, I was sure Mallett played, because I know Henne was injured along with Hart I believe, it was a while ago. I didn't have the big ten network so I didn't see that game, just remember watching highlights and listening to play by plays. And if that's the case, then that makes it worse if Henne was playing and they still lost and further proves my argument that key injuries matter, especially if we're losing to App. State. And again, there were more than injuries when Rich Rod started. But we're talking about Chad Henne, he was amazing at Michigan, and if his injury along with Hart and others had an effect to where they lost to App. State, then what does that say about Rich Rod's squad when he first started? At least in Carr's last season when everyone was back up to speed, they had the depth and experience to beat the defending national champions. Rich Rod did not have that luxury, and Ryan Mallett talked about transfering before Rodriguez was even a thought, so for those to say he ran off Mallett is inaccurate.

Green and Scarlet

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 10:02 a.m.

Webb - You brought Mallett up by referring to his performance in the App State game. I searched the box score from the UM - App State game and Henne was 19 of 37 for 233 yards and Mallett had no stats. I don't recall Mallett starting or even playing in the game. Don't let facts get in the way of your argument. UofM had and will again have a great football program...I'm just not convinced it will happen under RR. We'll see.

Robbie Webb

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 9:46 a.m.

3 and out, again...show me a team that had to go through youth, no depth, key injuries, walkons at key spots, and vert little veteran leadership on the field all at the same time and did well. Are you really that shocked Michigan struggled? Most people who actually know what's going on knows he can coach, and apparently you didn't read the Brandon Graham article. Do some research. And Green and Scarlet, what are you talking about? I never said the losses to App. State and Oregon were Ryan Mallett's fault, but he did start and play in those games because Henne was hurt in the beggining of the season. So why are you brining up Chad Henne? I used those two games as an example because people seem to think that if he alone had stayed then they would have done great and that's not quite the truth. Again, look at those two games. We got beat by App. State and stomped by Oregon, and that was with Carr's team that beat Florida that year. There were injuries that game where some didn't play, but we still loss to App. State. And what happened when Rich Rod showed up was on a much larger scale in terms of what was wrong with the team. So, with that being said, I'm still waiting for someone to prove me wrong. I'll wait.

Green and Scarlet

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 8:31 a.m.

R Webb - Seriously, blaming App State debacle on Ryan Mallet??? Who does your fact checking? RR? Ever hear of Chad Henne? You lose whatever credibility you may have had and come off as an apologist at best.

MetricSU

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 7:17 a.m.

Mitch: I agree with you about the sample size. There is no systematic bias, but the margin of error is about plus or minus 4 points. The confidence intervals certainly don't include 50% in the approval or disapproval categories.

3 And Out

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 3:33 a.m.

btw..Robbie aka Rich Rod's lawyer... RRs great offense finished 9th in the Big Ten play last year overall... 9th...and the defense was worse...that is on your man...he is a terrible coach who was overrated in a bad league with a great Pat White and Steve Slaton...buy a clue son..

3 And Out

Sun, Jun 6, 2010 : 3:30 a.m.

Robbie...thank YOU for proving my point of your blind ignorance... Reggie Bush, Woodson etc. are not College Football Coaches...and Harbaugh is. Get a clue. geeze... enough of your spin already your guy is dead in the water...dead man walking and will be gone after this bad upcoming season and you know it... Harbaughs offense would work at Michigan lol...yeah you are clueless.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 11:40 p.m.

I hope you're not a Spartan fan, because East Lansing is disgusting.

trigg7

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 11:37 p.m.

You guys are a MESS. All in for West Arbor.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 11:36 p.m.

VT's schedule isn't as tough as Michigan's, and Michigan's problems were leaps and bounds worse than VT. Coaching is not the issue. If Michigan stays healthy this year, there is no reason Michigan sholdn't win at least 9 games this year, including a bowl win.

wvtroll

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 10:44 p.m.

Just a little note about RR's recruiting power: In his last year at WVU, RR was trying to capture a pretty highly rated high school QB. At the time of RR's decision to abandon WVU, the recruit still had not decided on a school. RR apparently felt it was important enough to place a phone call to this recruit and let him know of his decision to leave, even before notifying his team of the departure. Well, the future QB decided not to follow RR and this kid named Pryor ended up at Ohio State. Make what you will of all this. The timing of the phone call was deplorable. I'm not sure I ever learned why Pryor decided against following RR, but I'm sure the call was an attempt to convince the young man to do so. Ultimately, if RR does not start winning big, recruits will avoid UM except those that feel they have a better chance of starting due to the lack of power recruits attending UM. This is not always a bad thing, as great recruits fail at times and walkons shine at times. In the end, it's what a coach does with what he ends up with that makes the difference. To address the bare cupboard: VT, a couple of years back, had a building year due to the number of seniors leaving and NFL draft entries. Soon after practice started, their star running back was injured and out for the year. Freshmen players were all over the place, but they ended up doing very well. Granted, they weren't changing offensive schemes, and had very little coaching turnovers, but the coach did what was necessary to make a team out of what he had. Frank Beamer also has one of the best defensive coaches in all of college football. So there's a little hint at what I think about which side of the ball wins games. With a great defense, you can't lose. Without a great offense, you probably won't win much. You need to keep the other team from scoring, but you need to score yourself, in other words.

BillMK

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 9:27 p.m.

I will be glad when we can talk about football. My opinion, which is worth no more than that of anyone else: 1. The poll is probably methodologically OK. 2. The poll lacks face value, in that the opinions of non-fans and "anti-fans" are of little importance. 3. That said, the most important opinions are those of those of the the administration, active alumni, and true friends of the university. By and large these people are not much influenced by the sorts of things that stir up comment on websites and talk radio. 4. What does matter is performance. 8 wins: vivat; 6 or less, farewell. That's it. We may know by early October. For now, all in for Michigan.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 8:23 p.m.

Jonny, did you pay attention to who was on the defensive roster this past year? Particularly secondary? Jordan Kovacs did outstanding for a walkon (second in the team in tackles with 75, second all big ten team) but when your walkon is outdoing others, what does that say about the depth? Again, go read the Brandon Graham article. It's not coaching.

johnnya2

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:59 p.m.

STOP WITH THE RR APOLOGIES. Good coaches do not make excuses. The numbers do not lie. The defense was HORRIBLE. Defense wins championships. Rich Rod is an offensive coach. Even if RR has the best offense in the country, it will not beat a great defense. This is the history of football. Hiring a coach for his offense was a stupid move. If you need proof, I suggest you look at the top 3 defenses in the Big Ten and where they played bowl games at. Look at the winner of offense vs defense in the SEC. Finally, the great defense destroyed little Colt McCoy in the BCS title game. By the way, I don't care about polls. They have nothing to do with what is RIGHT and what should be done. The average person does not know sh*t about football.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7 p.m.

And Ezeh*

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 6:59 p.m.

And Murrow, look at the starters on defense that returned. The line was never the issue, and still isn't. So exluding them, Morgan Trent was aweful, Warren, Brown, Mouton were all sophmores, which goes back to when I said youth. It's the same story, the secondary. Coaching is not the issue, and I have yet to see coaching fail. I would like you to point out where coaching, ''Failed''. With facts.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 6:55 p.m.

Murrow, Rich Rodriguez never ran off Ryan Mallett. He was on transfer notice before Rodriguez was even a thought. The new offense was just an exuse for him to leave. And even if he had stayed, they wouldn't have been Rose Bowl bound yet, Mallett was young at the time as well. Look what happened when he started against App. State and Oregon. So that's an invalid statement. And maybe you should take a look at the depth chart, or lack there of. I never said talent wasn't there, but for the most part, we're young, that's no secret, hence why we only have 12 seniors this upcoming season, and those 12 are still Carr's guys. Rod's eldest will be juniors this year. While I strongly disagree with your outcome of the season which wont happen, I am glad to see you are still behind the team and rooting for them.

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 6:46 p.m.

NimRod will be lucky to win 5 games this year. Then he'll be gone. Gotta love the "cupboard was bare" crowd. Yeah, after he ran off a QB who will be, at worst, a second round draft pick in 2011 as well as numerous other players. And please recall that he inherited a defensive team that returned EIGHT starters. Over the last two years I have watched his teams get worse as the season wore on. Over the last two seasons I have seen Chinese fire drills on the field and on the sidelines. These are powerful testimony to the fact that he is a miserable coach. I'll be rooting for the Wolverines to win 13 games this year (12 +1), but I have little hope of them having a winning season-- 5-7 or worse is more like it--and then we'll be done with this ethically challenged coach. Bo is spinnin' in his grave Good Night and Good Luck

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:51 p.m.

2sweetblue, of course I'll be alright. But people like 3 and Out think it's just easy to get a new coach and win on command. He doesn't realize all that was wrong with our team. I have to see coaching fail. He made mistakes on the field, but that happens with every coach, no one is perfect. But hey, if you don't want to take my word on Rodriguez, maybe you'll take Brandon Graham's. And I don't need to explain what kind of leader he is on and off the field. http://www.detnews.com/article/20100602/SPORTS0201/6020432/1131/SPORTS0201/Brandon-Graham--Rich-Rodriguez--made-us-all-better-players-

2sweetblue

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:46 p.m.

Take it easy Robbie... If Michigan does get rid of RR next will you be alright? I would say it is 50/50 that he will be around so please prepare yourself for that.... Of course the A.D is going to praise him right now. He can't say he is on thin ice it's all about recruiting. This is not rocket science. If or when RR is a proven liar he is gone, if he doe not win eight games he is gone. So please come to the reality that your "leader" just might not be around for much longer and then they can hire a real LEADER who has morals and is not crying all the time on National T.V.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:36 p.m.

''...after this upcoming 5-7 season it will be even more evident.'' Oh dang! Well then I withdraw my arguments to defend our team and coach by presenting the facts, because 3 and Out has spoken and Michigan will for sure have a losing season just because 3 and Out said so!

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:26 p.m.

And since you like to bring up players under Bo, I'll give you one. Dave Brandon, our athletic director (Although he wasn't 4th in the heisman race, so he wouldn't make a good coach. Don't you think that Dave, who played under Bo and knows about Michigan football and our traditions would have fired Rodriguez if he didn't think he was the right fit for Michgian? He has given Rodriguez high praise as a coach and knows why our record is the way it is, hence why he hasn't been fired, even after the NCAA handed out the sanctions.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:19 p.m.

3 and Out: ''Jim Harbaugh (4th in the Heisman vote in 86 under Bo at Michigan?)'' I guess that means Reggie Bush, Same Bradford, Tim Tebow, Charles Woodson, etc. would make excellent coaches anywhere because they WON the heisman! I can't believe you said that. Thank you for proving my point.

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:04 p.m.

3 and out. Yes, I most certainly think Rodriguez is a better fit for Michigan. For the reason that Harbaugh runs a different offense, an offense that hasn't worked for Michigan in recent times, which is why Michigan has only won one championship in the last 50+ years, my friend. That is the same offense Harbaugh would bring in. Michigan does not need to have a coaching who played at Michigan. Bo didn't. And what on Earth does Harbaugh's statistics at quarterback years ago have to do with Michigan's future? Why would you bring that up? That doesn't make sense. I am very aware of Harbaugh's achievements at quarterback, but it's not relevant to what he would do as head coach at Michigan. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, but not what Michigan needs to move forward. You seem to forget the big ten is behind in the new millenia, hence why the big ten as a whole has only won 3 national championships since 1970. Bringing in someone like Harbaugh would set the program back even further by changing the offense back to the old one that wont get them a championship. And it wasn't an offensive problem, it was defense, not offense. No one is questioning Michigan's ability to score. If you would do some homework you would know that and realize that it's not a coaching error. Show me a team that had to go through youth, no depth, key injuries, walkons at key spots, and very little veteran leadership and exprerience all at the same time and did well. I ask that because that's what happened, and no one has been able to prove me wrong on that.

3 And Out

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 4:28 p.m.

Robbie...lol are you kidding around? so RR in your opinion is a better fit for Michigan than Jim Harbaugh (4th in the Heisman vote in 86 under Bo at Michigan?) lol...whatever... keep spinning. Do you work for Rich Rod's camp? Seriously Rich Rod is a terrible fit for Michigan and was a desperate and non researched hire by Bill Martin. The numbers speak for themselves and after this upcoming 5-7 season it will be even more evident.

larry eiler

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 2:57 p.m.

20-26 favorable to unfavorable on our football coach? This is a meaningless piece of info based on 30-odd replies -- and with more than half of the 64 respondents having no opinion. Where's the story? Larry Eiler

Robbie Webb

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 2:10 p.m.

3 and out. Give up on Harbaugh, he will never be at Michigan. He's not even a good fit for Michigan, and Rodriguez is not going anywhere. Show me a team that had to go through youth, no depth, key injuries, walkons at key spots, and very little veteran leadership and experience all at the same time and did well. Yeah, that's what I thought.

azwolverine

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 1:57 p.m.

By the way, to follow up, opinions really don't matter...8-16 does. Win some games and rising opinions will follow. Cupboard bare? Not so bare we should have ever lost to a 3-9 Toledo (or a 3-9 Purdue or 3-9 Illinois, for that matter). As I said, win some games and rising opinions will follow. However, only beating OSU will truly soothe the masses.

azwolverine

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 1:51 p.m.

Maybe some fans would be happier if the title of the article were "Only 20% of M Fans Have Favorable Opinion of RR." That would be accurate according to the poll, and would lead to the factual conclusions that, based on the poll, 80% of M fans have an opinion of RR other than 'favorable.' Would that title stop the sniping at Rothstein for the title of the article? No, it would just give fans another excuse to snipe at the messenger. Bottom line is, the majority of Michigan fans (as per this poll), either dislike or don't care about RR regardless of what the title of the article is.

3 And Out

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 1:34 p.m.

So...apologists...you are saying that Michigan has 7-16 (RRs record at Michigan in BCS game w/ 3 BT wins) Talent level? lol...whatever. 3 and Out for RR in 10. Someone get Jimmy H on the phone.

Terry Star21

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 12:12 p.m.

Poll.. '..20% of Michigan voters describing themselves as fans...', are you kidding me? Look at all the commenters on this football page calling themselves 'True Blue', 'Die-Hard' fans, then 2 seconds later trash the coach, team or University... come on. It's obvious, the 20% negative to our king RichRod might be season ticket holders, watchers, etc. - but they are no fans! Try polling Michigan Football Faithful, who never have to call themselves fans - HUGE difference here. The good news is, RichRod is going to be hated much more in January by msu, osu and our bowl opponent - but he will handle it just find. Oh yea, he is going to continue to hear negatives during his next 20 or so years as Michigan coach, but once Rodriguez Hall is completed - the negatives will die down to just outsiders like msu, osu, etc. for 20 years of losses to the 'UM'.

clownfish

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 9:57 a.m.

Amusing, some of the people that are attacking A2.com for not living up to it's potential are the same people defending RR. My assumption...those paid the highest have the lowest expectations put upon them. What he may not understand is the average Ann Arbor News reader expects far more after the headlines. But, MI fans don't have many expectations for their tax dollars? --------------- I wish we had a real newspaper with professional reporters in town.Spinning stories seems to be the norm here.Well at least I dont have to pay for it because I dont buy the paper versions Gee, why don't we have such a paper? Complain when it's free, excuse when its' $2.5 million a year, on the publics back.

NoBowl4Blue

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 9:17 a.m.

LOL a friend outside of Columbus e-mailed that OSU fans are 100% behind Rich Rod.

Elaine F. Owsley

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 8:44 a.m.

Well, let's see...it cost a bundle to get him; he hasn't fielded a winning team; he was in trouble with the NCAA where he came from; he got UM in trouble with the NCAA here; What's not to like?

Bookbag

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 8:09 a.m.

IN ROD WE TRUST! This is the year -

Mark

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:57 a.m.

By the way, my comment was in response to both the pollster and Rothstein (aa2.com).

Jaxon5

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:56 a.m.

Whatever the poll says, fans have reason to have a negative opinion. Look at the other coaches in the league. I believe if talent levels were equal, the following coaches would win vs UM based on coaching alone: Tressel, Paterno, Ferentz, DAntonio, Bielema, Fitzgerald, and even Hope (look at actual record vs UM and OSU). That puts UM at # 8 or# 9 in the Big Ten based on coaching alone. All of the above coaches took a program and made it better or maintained program excellence. UM went in the opposite direction.

Mark

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:37 a.m.

I don't see the statistics the way you see it at all. Only 1 in 4 are unfavorable of Rodriquez. Sure only 20 % are favorable, but the rest are undecided. That does not mean dislike; that means let's wait and see. Here's the real truth: "...when those same people were asked if they'd like to see Rodriguez replaced as Michigan's coach, 51 percent said they'd like to see him continue. 20 percent wanted him replaced and 29 percent were undecided." Only 1 in 5 want him replaced. The rest (80%) want him to succeed. "I thought the message was, we don't like you very much but you've only been here two years," Jensen said. "We'll give you another season, so we'll reserve judgment." This is a joke! I agree people are in a wait and see mode, but there is nothing in these statistics that would tell me they don't like Rodriquez. This is just one man's opinion about some numbers and it sounds like he has an agenda. He certainly isn't looking at objectively.

townie54

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:30 a.m.

I wish we had a real newspaper with professional reporters in town.Spinning stories seems to be the norm here.Well at least I dont have to pay for it because I dont buy the paper versions

townie54

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:23 a.m.

mostly people that have an unfavorable opinion are gonna answer the poll

Jaxon5

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 7:02 a.m.

During the past 2 seasons, UM lost its 2nd place on the National Championship Era (1936 and later) all time wins and win percentage to both OSU and Penn State. (Oklahoma was already in first place) The all time win total and percentage will be next to fall at the current pace. Within this decade, Texas will pass UM in win totals and percentage with an average margin of 5 plus victories per season.

gavsulaker

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 6:36 a.m.

Is it possible for Ann.Arbor.com to write an article that actually looks like real journalism? Not only is the title misleading, the article really proves nothing. Why don't you do some "real" journalism and interview high school/college/pro coaches and ask them their opinion on the job RR has been doing? How about interviewing other coaches who run the spread option and ask them about player development, etc.? Or is that just too much work or just "over your heads"? Probably the only reason this article was written is because it has been about 2 weeks since the last negative article on Michigan/RR. Give it up already...

MetricSU

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 6:24 a.m.

Mitch: Only Michigan fans were asked the questions about UM football. So the results should be representative of UM football fans.

worldchamp

Sat, Jun 5, 2010 : 5:03 a.m.

I am a person that listens to reason. I will give him til the end of this season. Think about it they had gone to (i think) 33 straight bowl games (Yes we have been spoiled). We always it seemed had the longer football season and the players always got an extra season to work out (bowl season) and make the Michigan program atractive. Now, think about it for a minute. We have not gone to a bowl game in almost three years. Think about this: how many fair weathered fans will start jumping ship when the boat starts rockin'. Mary Sue Coleman and Dave Brandon have a bunch of luxury suites to fill, in this economy those folks do not need another anchor holding the ship down. I'm not sure, if we do have another season of being below average and not making a bowl game, will we lose people in the stands? After all it has been a great deal of fun these last 40 years watching and being part of the Michigan football program. I certainly do not fault Bill Martin for anything. He, if anything was a pretty good decision maker, regarding facilities and staying out of the various coaches way. Not every choice turns out to be the right one. Let him finish his contract out, let's see what his graduation rate is, and the strength of his football program after the year is over. Let's also make sure this storied program has no more infractions. I would rather be a Michigan program, than a USC or a Clemson (didn't RR coach at Clemson) type program. One more thing: the thought of losing to Michigan State AND that school to the south of us really makes me sad. I do hope the best for Michigan football.

MetricSU

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 10:04 p.m.

As a matter of fact, I'm still not sold on Dantonio, either. But RR is certainly making it easier for MD. Dantonio is not a great game coach, but if RR keeps stumbling, MD might get enough good recruits to win games anyway. We'll see. (Kind of like Saban at Alabama, who's doing it all on recruiting.) You want to think MD is promoting a thuggish environment because it makes you feel better. He made a mistake by not wanting to give up on a few kids. He's paid for it, and will continue to. Hopefully he's learned a lesson. In fact, MSU has lots of good kids, and is recruiting a lot more good ones. (Not, say, guys who've confessed to three felonies.) Dantonio probably has two years to get to something like 9-3. I'm not sure he can do it, but neither are you. Just like I'm not sure UM can't win 8 or 9 this year. They could.

RayA2

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 9:21 p.m.

I think that Mr. Rodriguez'z personality has not endeared him to other coaches. Consequently the events that led to the NCAA violations are really nothing unusual, probably even common place in places like the SEC or Big 12. I did not follow Mr. Rodriguez at his former school but the main thing to consider is that Rich Rodriguez has not shown in his 2 years that he can develop talent. Michigan has always had access to the best high school talent in the country but that is not good enough. The coach has to effectively manage a staff that develops each recruit to its highest level. So far the results are not there. The spread offense has its advantages but its disadvantages seldom get discussed. Successful programs around the country have integrated the spread offense into more conventional sets. They can do so because they have well developed talent capable of mastering whatever is asked of them. I say if Mr. Rodriguez does not show much improvement at all positions in his first 3 games, replace him.

aarox

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 8:55 p.m.

I agree. He is like David Mayo, a Wolverine in Spartan clothes. Still, the poll speaks for itself. Methinks he saw this as an opportuntity to make a point.

a2bnr

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 8:50 p.m.

Dude, this guy is a disaster. He is a journalist in Ann Arbor and the articles written make it seem like he doesn't favor the Michigan Wolverines and are out to show them in a bad light. This is not the way to make it as a journalist. I shake my head not at him, but the people who hired him and keep him around.

aarox

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 8:39 p.m.

Just as a follow-on, would you expect Bo Schembechler would have a 20% favorable rating*?? That is RR's rating by this poll. But this is not really fair, since 54% of those polled had no opinion on this. * prior to firing Ernie Harwell

aarox

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 8:33 p.m.

We are all missing the point, and Michael hinted at it. Here's the point. Forget the 54% undecided and look at the 46% that actually are following this. Of those that ARE decided, 57% are against RR. (26% of the 46%) THAT is what this poll says. Opposing views welcome as usual.

aareader

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 8:16 p.m.

Most headlines I see in any publication are misleading. That is how they get us to take a look at the story. Michael Rothstein is good at this and does get many readers attention. What he may not understand is the average Ann Arbor News reader expects far more after the headlines. He has been reporting in this style starting with articles on Notre Dame here last year. The good news for us is the our readers WILL NOT just accept what he writes at face value.. Sooner we will cease to read his postings if they do not appear sincere. It just proves that on this site sloppy reporters will get called out. :+}

Paul the Malcontent

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 7:03 p.m.

Well, the headline is correct, albeit misleading. Note the headline's wording: "Polling website says..." On Public Policy Polling's website, their story is headlined "Rodriguez on shaky ground with Michigan fans." So it is actually the polling company that first used a misleading headline, which probably should make one question the unbiased nature of their polling (or at least the interpretations they offer of their numbers). AnnArbor.com is just guilty of lazily "reporting" on the polling company's release (they did apparently contact Tom Jensen to add a few quotes).

RWBill

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 6:58 p.m.

What a horrible excuse for journalism. Deceptive and intentionally devious headline with no factual support. I rue the day that mlive got linked to this piece of trash web site. Absolute trash is this place.

dave

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 6:17 p.m.

how about this for a poll: Do you have a favorable or unfavorable opinion of the journalists and publications covering UM football?

The1Cool

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:43 p.m.

The headline is misleading, but technically isn't lying. It says "Michigan fans have unfavorable opinion of RR" not a majority of UofM fans or most fans. As long as there are 2 UofM fans out there w/ an unfavorable opinion the headline isn't lying. It's just a cheap move to get people to click the link. I'm surprised the poll numbers weren't worse by how people whine about RR. I guess the complainers are usually the loudest.

MetricSU

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:37 p.m.

Public Policy Polling needs more imagination. They missed an opportunity to report the same results for MSU fans. Plus, they should have added the same questions about Tom Izzo. That would've really gotten them some notariety. After all, UM is supposed the "football school" and MSU the "basketball school."

MetricSU

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:32 p.m.

This just in: 85% of MSU fans would like to see RR continue as UM football coach.

Danny

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:24 p.m.

RR took over a program in shambles, destined to struggle. He implemented a new system and ran the system with underclassmen, what do we expect. I think RR is a good coach, however this year will tell how good? All the pressure from fair weather fans did not help. Trying to cut corners on the rule book did not help. He should be able to concentrate more on football this year. Good luck RR, the position is yours to win or lose! Blue fan in Georgia

T. hall

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:22 p.m.

Sorry Mr. Rosenberg Redux, but your interpretation and the headline are misleading. You don't deserve the Voice.

Yelmonian

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 5:15 p.m.

2SweetBlue... You hit it on the head. Tater's day revolves around the Spartans. He is on Spartan sites all day everyday. And if I hear his Misdemeanor State joke one more time... I might wretch. Sorta like eating Big Macs... after the first 20,000... you just feel ill. Come on folks... there is very little else to talk about until football starts. NBA basketball is wretched. We are in the "slow baseball" season... with it's 1 billion games, and there is no point in watching how many games back your team is... becasue there are a billion more to go. So... you write a headline... and BAM... you get 24 comments, most angered, and willing to come back again to see what other bad headlines are written. So... if the pole is posted... who cares. Also... does the writer actually write his own Headline? I know with the papers, that is not always the case.

Robbie Webb

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 4:12 p.m.

Michael, show me where it says fans have an unfavorable opinion. I must be missing something. I don't see where it shows that.

a2miguy

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:47 p.m.

Come on, Michael. That headline is contrived and you know it. The poll says 26% have an unfavorable opinion, which means that 74% have some OTHER than an unfavorable opinion. This sensational headline, followed by the story itself, is like writing the headline "Explosion Shocks Downtown Ann Arbor" with a story about a kid who scared a few folks when hit set off a firecracker.

A2

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:30 p.m.

Right Rocco, but you actually had to spend maybe 2 minutes thinking and typing your comment. Annarbor.com cant seem to do that. Instead they just throw a silly headline up and hope to get clicks. Bravo Bravo.

karen

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:28 p.m.

I clicked on the link to the actual survey. Most of the questions are totally ridiculous. What does is matter what race you are, your age, gender and who you voted for President, when taking a poll about Michigan football. You are a terrible reporter, Michael Rothstein!

Robbie Webb

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:27 p.m.

Nobowl, why are you surprised? I've explained this to you this whole time. This is not Rich Rod's fault. Again, show me a team that had to go through youth, no depth, key injuries, walkons at key spots, and very little veteran leadership and experience and did well. THAT'S why their record is the way it is. Not coaching. Read this article. If you don't want to take my word on Rich Rodriguez, maybe you'll take Brandon Graham's. And I think everyone who likes college football in general who knows what kind of player and person Graham was on and off the field is someone who knows what he's talking about. http://www.detnews.com/article/20100602/SPORTS0201/6020432/1131/SPORTS0201/Brandon-Graham--Rich-Rodriguez--made-us-all-better-players- Rich Rod had to build his way up with what he had. He had to recruit alot of players on both sides of the ball on a count of losing alot of them after Carr left and alot being young.

rocco

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:18 p.m.

The data are worth looking at. First, the sample is of 890 MI voters only 37% of whom are MI fans. The sample is 53% women and 83% white. By age group there are more than three times older respondents over 65 (24%) than younger ones between 18-29(8%). Of the MI fans, 51% would like him to continue and 29% are unsure. Of the MI fans, more older than younger respondents would like him to continue. Note the next sets of data include MI State Fans and Non-Michigan Fans. It would have been a lot more useful to stick with the subset of MI fans since who cares what the others think. Right? Regarding favorability of Rich Rod,for all age groups there is a lot of uncertainty especially among middle and older age groups. Regarding favorability of Rich Rod, whites are less favorable toward him than African Americans. Regarding favorability of Rich Rod, women are less favorable than men and more uncertain about him. If I had to rewrite the headline based on the data, I would say MI Fans and Others Seem Willing to Give Rich Rod More Time.

David

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 3:18 p.m.

Congratulations, you guys got the page views you were looking for thanks to an inflammatory, yet inaccurate headline. 26% of people had an unfavorable view of Rich Rod, is that a majority? You can't draw any conclusions from a poll that had such a large number of undecided voters. I badly want annarbor.com to succeed having read the Ann Arbor News for so many years. However, you guys are getting close to going down the Free Press' path. You guys should look carefully at how the Free Press' readership and online viewership has declined drastically ever seen it's lambasting of the Michigan program. I'm not saying this is all due to the Michigan football community's "boycott" of the Free Press, but the Detroit News isn't suffering the same sort of decline that the Free Press has seen. All I'm saying is tread carefully in such a football loving community. At least present unbiased journalism rather than journalism that generates page views in the short term.

A2

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:57 p.m.

Cool story dude!!!!!! Wow this website is much better than the paper you guys used to put out. Wait no its not.

gobluegal63

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:46 p.m.

Rich needs to hold his head high......

InsideTheHall

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:39 p.m.

Interesting that 40% claim they are conservative and only 19% liberal. Gosh, Fox News does report the facts!

Freemind42

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:35 p.m.

So how is this viewed as a negative rating? You say that 51% are undecided while only 26% have an unfavorable view. It seems as if you are trying to create a narrative here. What I get out of this poll is that a majority of people are willing to withhold judgment for a little while longer (i.e. they do NOT have an unfavorable view of RR).

Michael Rothstein

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:33 p.m.

Just wanted to note I added something. In the polling, the only people who were asked about Rodriguez were those who said they were Michigan fans. That should clear up some of the confusion. Added that into the story as well.

jgp

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:28 p.m.

You're right Paco, Mike's report is not a complete distortion of the truth, just a partial distortion. The results of the poll suggest to me that the majority of those polled (not necessarily 'Michigan fans') were withholding judgment on RR and most definitely were not ready for him to be fired. This not exactly the impression you get from reading the headline or story.

andy

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:25 p.m.

shouldn't you also ask questions like, do you watch football? do you watch michigan football? do you know who rich rod is? big lack in good qualifying questions.

Frank99

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:18 p.m.

Well, that was 5 minutes of my life I'll never get back. Totally incomprehensible.

truebluefan

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 2:01 p.m.

Nobowl - Spin this data any way you want, but the fact remains that only 2 out of 10 people agree with you in that they feel RR should be fired. You are firmly in the minority. Sixty percent want him to continue! The people have spoken.

voiceofreason

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 1:53 p.m.

Wow. This is ridiculous. Never in my life did I think "journalism" would hit rock bottom.

Paco12054

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 1:43 p.m.

The truth is that an outside poll taken showed the numbers reported in this article. Argue if you will with the poll itself, or perhaps argue that this subject should not be reported on this site, but to say that Mike's report is not the truth is a complete distortion of the truth. Responsible journalism is reporting such as this, it is not reporting only what we as individuals want to hear.

NoBowl4Blue

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 1:42 p.m.

Very surprized the unfavorable opinion wasn't higher. All Rich Rod has done is bring unfavorable attention to the football program and under achievement. 40 straight years of going to Bowls and now 2 straight with no appearances and a 8-16 record. NOT TO MENTION LAST PLACE finish in Big Ten. Who would have ever imagined? No the cupboards were not bare and yes RR is wrong for Michigan.

sam

Fri, Jun 4, 2010 : 1:35 p.m.

Every time this guy Micheal writes an article it is always negative about RR. It is very clear what his views/opinions are. This just shows how poor of a journalist he really is. As a journalist you are supposed to be unbiased and report the truth. Your work Micheal is obviously biased and can not be accepted as a legit piece. Please try to eliminate your bias and report the truth!!!