Me Next

Mon, May 17, 2010 : 11:46 a.m.

This is not unusual, & has not been for decades. What is non-productive is the mandated Reaction to child behaviors. I too believe this happens all over in the USA. I have many stories of the same, milder, or worse. The cure was pushed as "Zero Tolerance". In order to keep Federal Funds for public school operations what actually happened was "normal protections" were outlawed. The children so protected, there were no present protections. Reflects society at large. In obedience to no self defense, civil students & rule abiding students are harmed by students who know they are protected from their victim & removal from school society because each student is revenue. We must change Federal Funds/child with strings/adopting Fed regulations to receive funds. Public Schools must return to State Ultimate Authority & Local Power over Discipline & Educational Guidance. The only string Federal can Constitutionally require is that the per child Fed Taxes contribution must be to support the Basic Subjects' (3 Rs) common need of each & every child claimed. Because a child was injured, long-term is tentative as time passes, then this is a JD incident. The "headband" symbolized what? Taking it & running is child behavior; it was the "mob mentality" of group inflicted harm that is the criminal action. In adult life this "mob mentality" results in social, economic, & physical harm for any outsider the "click" deems fair game. Why the majority opinion of this society, that it was outside norm behavior, was not interfered with is the result of Federal Zero Tolerance. Same reason "prison neighborhoods" - those law abiders are locking themselves inside their homes & not "talking to police". So protected - no real protection at all. In the past normal coping skills of victim & general society there that could have prevented or non-violently dealt with this situation. Today a victim can not even "hold an aggressor" without striking back, to prevent further assault on self until an adult can take over the control. It is not reasonable to expect all children will rely on adults in dealing with conflicts - for the most part. What was "Protector Children" & adults, that would be present, would be Status harmed to interfere & violators of the Federal Regulation subject to punishment to prevent the school losing Fed Funds. The only thing State Legislators will do with their State Statutory Law is appear to be dealing with a real problem, but it in reality removes protections children need to learn to be successful & productive adults in greater society. This violent act is already unlawful & rightfully so. Verbal bullying is not unusual but the suicides reveal the victims see no future outside the small little world "Protections" have instilled in these children that lack adequate Coping Skills. No value outside being a group member has caused many suicides by children, older children & young adults. This inflicted ideology packaged as "fairness" is really hazardous to a future & necessary self-determined adult life.

onlinejoey

Mon, May 17, 2010 : 9:45 a.m.

The Saline Reporter is reporting that charges have not been sought - what gives? http://heritage.com/articles/2010/05/17/saline_reporter/news/doc4bed929058478869691902.txt

cfsunlet

Mon, May 17, 2010 : 9:38 a.m.

Bullying is nothing new. Racial problems in Saline and elsewhere is nothing new. Ganging up one kid is nothing new in Saline or elsewhere. (Hopefully) Holding all those accountable for their role is not new. What is new? All of the attention this is getting. Why should we (society) care? Is this our problem? Can we do something about it, too? Perhaps we can make sure that schools are well-funded so that children can be safely and adequately supervised at all times by trained professionals that know the kids and dynamics to watch out for. If we are going to engage in finger-pointing we might as well complete the circle and look at everyone who has the power to make a difference.

cfsunlet

Mon, May 17, 2010 : 9:36 a.m.

I am proud of Saline. I grew up in Saline. I live in Saline now because I feel Saline provides a great education opportunity for my child. My son is an 11 year-old at Heritage. Though he wasn't involved in this, it has prompted a lot of discussions in our household. This is not a straight-up simple situation, bu there are simple rules to draw from it and move forward. Rules any 11 year-old can understand like--don't call people names, don't hurt others, walk away from a situation, get help immediately is you see this happening or if it is happening to you. Saline is doing their best to handle this situation and not sweep it under the rug. I commend the leadership for the steps they have taken to help all involved learn a lifelong lesson and hopefully make better choices in the future.

Kelly

Sat, May 15, 2010 : 5:01 p.m.

@SalineMom.....Yes, I do know for a fact that other children have been physically hurt during recess by other children on purpose in Saline Schools this school year. I am related to one of the children to whom this occurred this year. Thankfully only 1 other child joined in the attack and 4 other children intervened to rescue my relative. This occurred at a 1st-4th grade elementary school. Children from 3 classrooms were witness, but none of the 4 paid staff members ever saw anything. All the children had the same exact version of the story. The main differences between what happened to my relative & that of the 5th or 6th grader in the article above, is the other 1st-4th graders did intervene and my relative fortunately did not need emergency medical care. The administration continues to work with my relative to provide the support necessary. There has indeed been an increase in supervision on the playground. Unfortunately, in my opinion, the staff:child ratios continue to be inadequate and will only increase next year. At no girl scout camp in the country would you find 25 Brownie scouts playing at an accredited camp with only 1 staff member present. Like wise, you would not find 4 staff members watching 83 Brownie scouts by themselves. As a society, we must find the funds necessary to provide adequate staff:child ratios at ALL our public schools. History has shown time and time again that when not properly supervised, children will act out when tempers flare. 7 kids kicking a child until they need to be taken to the E.R. is a matter of poor supervision. Neither the staff member, nor the children had a chance to succeed. Instead we have 7 heading to court, 1 traumatized, and 1 wondering how they could have prevented it. I can only hope the meeting on Monday at Pleasant Ridge Elementary will lead to actual solutions.

Sandra Samons

Sat, May 15, 2010 : 2:45 p.m.

I am utterly disgusted by this incident, events leading up to it, and some of the comments of readers and parents. What century are we living in? Boys will be boys? No school personnel supervising these kids, just a volunteer? This incident is clearly the culmination of a long series of inappropriate juvenile behaviors, taking place over who knows how long (since kindergarten?), without adequate adult intervention and supervision. There are so many things wrong with this picture that it would take a thesis to enumerate them all! Did the police question children (any of them) without parents present? Why is name calling of any kind allowed in our schools? Why is disrespectful physical contact of any kind (much less threatening or assaultive behavior)being tolerated in a school? Why are these kids not being taught basic human values and appropriate social behavior? Why are parents defending these behaviors instead of stepping up to the task of teaching their children to behave properly? Why does anyone think the best way to handle this situation is by using the criminal justice system? If we are going to go that route, then lets bring charges against all of the parents and the school personnel? This incident is a sad illustration of a general deterioration in moral values that should be alarming to us all. Are we, as a society, going to become less civilized over time? Enough of a rant! I hope I have made my point. Will it make any difference?

KeepingItReal

Sat, May 15, 2010 : 4:31 a.m.

In my earlier post, I meant to use the word "condemned" instead of "condoned" to describe my surprise to the bloggers comments regarding this incident, many of them Saline parents or residents.

saline mama

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 5:58 p.m.

This is a very scary incident. Thankfully the boy appears to be ok. I'm glad the police and the district are taking this seriously. I would be mortified if any of these kids were my children. We need more love and understanding. And yes I do agree that it begins at home.Let's listen to our kids, be involved and most importantly, be positive role models for them.

Lokalisierung

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 4:54 p.m.

Plantation, Florida 98% Mentor, Ohio 97% Dubuque, Iowa 95% Parma, Ohio 95% Close to that Kettering, Ohio 94% Bismarck, North Dakota 94% Warwick, Rhode Island 94% Livonia, Michigan 94% Maple Grove, Minnesota 94% Weymouth, Massachusetts 94% Royal Oak, Michigan 94% Janesville, Wisconsin 94% Cheektowaga, New York 94% Minnetonka, Minnesota 94% But anyway, I'm sure what you both meant is cities with comparable populations and college towns. You should only look at comparable cities. A constant problem around here.

a2citizen

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 4:44 p.m.

DwightSchrute said: "...72.8 percent is very diverse in comparison it to most other U.S. cities, where the percent of white people is 95 percent or more." Dwight, please name three cities in the U.S. that are 95% or more white. I will make it easy: just name ONE. Also, "diverse in comparison"? What does that mean? Like I said, I grew up in Detroit (not a suburb) and the city was 81.6% black. So the question is, is Detroit diverse? Or is it "diverse by comparison"?

PiHi91

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 4:14 p.m.

Take out the fact that the child assulted was black and my opinion would not change. This is child was assulted! He was kicked in the head several times cause him to have seziure like symptoms. How can anyone not see that as serious. My 17yr old son was jumped by the boys last year and as a mother I drove around that are for 3days looking for them. Why to call the police and have them arrested. This is not a game. What if the child had died? The youth of today have no respect for life. They need to be made an example of or believe me next time a child could suffer perment injury or death.

Lokalisierung

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2:28 p.m.

"Im not saying the kids should get off easy.If their guilty of this then they should be expelled from school or whatever they do to kids now days" Well I'd disagree with you and say Expellesion (sp?) is a lot more serious and amaging than an assualt Misdemeanor. So I don't know if that's the outcome you want if you think the original punishment was too hard.

scooter dog

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2:19 p.m.

Im not saying the kids should get off easy.If their guilty of this then they should be expelled from school or whatever they do to kids now days But calling the police for 11-12 yr olds,please I don't buy it.If you want to call anyone call there parents and kick them out of school and nip it in the bud,wow,wouldn't want anything drastic to happen at the saline schools they might call the FBI.

scooter dog

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 1:55 p.m.

Boys will be boys,A totally blown out of proportion waste of police time and resources.It should have been handled internally in the schools.If the kid was so seriously hurt why did they release him in less than 4 hrs.If the kid was white this would never make the papers(buddy).Just another knee jerk responce to an incompentant school district. I have nothing against the saline pd and I think mr Bunten does a fine job as chief,just as he did when he was working for AAPD. I just think its been blown way out of proportion and 7 young kids are probably sorry that it happened but thanks to the saline schools it not just the start of something they washed their hands of and should of taken responsibility for.

Lokalisierung

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:30 a.m.

Agree with Atticus. It's one thing for "boys being boys" to get in a fight and get injured I wouldn't be broken up about that. But when kids are already showing this much of a pack mentality and beating down a kid 7 on 1...what the heck do you expect to happen?

failed2conform

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:29 a.m.

There ya go Atticus! Any kid who kicked the victim in the head should be expelled! The others involved should receive lengthy suspensions, and all should be processed thru the juvenile court. 100% agreed. Isn't Saline a school of choice at that level? Doesn't that also include the right to deny enrollment to those who chooses to not abide by the rules set by the district? One would think Saline would be all over this to demonstrate their concern for student safety and perhaps boost enrollment.

jlkddd

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:28 a.m.

Has anyone posting on this blog gone to Saline schools within the past 30 or so years? If so, you know that racial discrimination has ALWAYS been an issue with Saline Schools. I believe that there was some racial discrimination involved with this. Especially since the boy claims that weeks earlier one of the boys referred to him by the name "slave." I wish people in Saline would just wake up and realize that there is a problem with diversity in the district, and the way children act towards diverse students. Yes, there needs to be classes on how to handle bullying, but where are the classes on how to teach diversity??? I surely didn't take any when I was in Saline Schools.

Atticus F.

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:16 a.m.

How would you people feel if your child were bullied this terribly by the other kids? and then beaten unconcious and kicked in the head until he/she was having sezuires? It really brings sadness to my heart to think of any child being bullied and tormented to this point.

Nick

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:15 a.m.

It's whimsical yet sad reading the "boys will be boys" and "back in my day..." rationalizing of violence by the commenters here. I'm not too far removed from 5th/6th grade to remember that violence was wrong, fighting wasn't allowed, and ganging up on 1 person was utterly wrong. We engaged in violent behavior at our own risk of being EXPELLED. I hope SAS has the guts to kick these bad apples out of the orchard.

Lokalisierung

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:14 a.m.

I think it actually makes sense. There's a new hysteria goign on now with "cyber bullying" and kids being picked on committing suicide so I think they are trying to set a tone. I believe A&B is a Misdemeanor so no big woop.

DwightSchrute

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:08 a.m.

To a2citizen, the 72.8 percent is very diverse in comparison it to most other U.S. cities, where the percent of white people is 95 percent or more.

DwightSchrute

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11:03 a.m.

Scooter, you're comment sounds dangerously close to racism, buddy. If the kid were white, hell yes there'd be talk about it. In fact, I'd venture to say the outrage would be even bigger out of Saline. Furthermore, having been both a hoodlum and an assailant in my middle school years, I guarantee everyone here that the one black assailant was an assailant here only to prevent himself from facing a such a beatdown. The blame starts with the parents who didn't teach their kids. No question about it.

a2citizen

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 11 a.m.

@sh1 and arthguinness: Unfortunately sarcasm is not easily conveyed in a blog. I am just amused by people who talk about the diversity of Ann Arbor (72.8% white, sampling size=114,386). I guess some people consider that diverse. But what would I know about statistical analysis. I grew up in Detroit and I guess that's not a very diverse city either. (81.6% black, sampling size 871,121). WIth all the coverage that race has been getting recently, remember, the pendulum swings both ways when it comes to diversity.

ffej440

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 10:59 a.m.

Up until now I felt this was overblown.The information that these kids planned this fight as a group changes everything for me.This displays a "gang" mentality that can not be tolarated at any level. Better to help these kids through juvenile court than risk this behavoir going into adulthood.

John

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 10:25 a.m.

To add: it is called Matt's Safe School Law. If interested go to: www.MattEpling.com and/or www.bullypolice.org/mi_law.html

John

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 10:18 a.m.

At this time Michigan does not have an anti-bullying law. It is working its way through the Michigan legislature. I has passed the House and is up for vote in the Senate and will be signed by the governor. As I understand, this makes the schools responsible to uphold the law.

jns131

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:24 a.m.

Michigan has an anti bullying law. I was bullied as a child and everyone called it playground fun. Children will be children. My daughter was being bullied on the playground. I threatened a lawsuit unless something was done. It was. The child who bullied mine? No longer is in any school I know of. I do not tolerate it and no one should put up with it. No shocker here. But bullying has been going on for centuries. It has taken wake up calls and lawsuits to put it into perspective. I will be following this case closely.

UWM

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:16 a.m.

Ok, before people get too high and holy about how racist Saline is and how tolerant and diverse Ann Arbor is, it's time for a reality check: When I attended the AAPS in the 1960s and '70s is was a time of great racial unrest. Black kids from AA and elsewhere (Ypsi, Willow Run, etc.) would come to the schools to bully, harass and beat up white kids. Some of the black kids were my fellow students. I personally was bullied and beat up because I was a "honkey white boy," and I recall seeing a white girl literally being dragged down the hallway by her hair by a black girl, while other black girls screamed at and kicked her, all while the teachers looked on and did nothing. This type of thing was quite common then. In the name of "sensitivity" and "understanding" for the feelings of the black kids (who apparently, according to the administrators, were justified in hating white kids) the AAPS did nothing until us white kids had had enough, started banding together and fighting back. Then they swooped in and tried to put an end to it by - you guessed it - cracking down on the white kids. All this did was create a sense of entitlement in the black kids and resentment in the white kids. Perhaps the parents of the kids involved in this mess taught their kids a lesson based on their own experiences 35 years ago (i.e., resentment of black kids and the special treatment they receive). Who knows? However, IMHO a good lesson here is to not make the same mistake the AAPS did back then by tolerating this sort of thing. It's possible, perhaps even probable, that all it will do will be to cause the situation to escalate. Either way, again, let's not get all high and holy about how much better the AAPS and Ann Arbor in general is compared to Saline. Ann Arbor has a long history, and much of it is not as warm, fuzzy and progressive as many would like to believe.

babarossa

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:16 a.m.

@ Scooter dog "Boys will be boys,talk about overkill,but the victim is black so if it were a white boy we would not be talking about this here,right?" "Wow,Must be real slow at the saline police dept these days,really!charging 11-12 yr olds.This needs to be handled at the schools not the police dept. This has got to be the biggest waste of taxpayer money I have ever heard of. Whats next,you going to charge seniors with jay walking their dogs. A real pathetic farce." With comments like this no wonder our youths keep learning it is ok to call a kid a slave (no matter the race) or to plan a premeditated assault, causing grevious bodily harm. It starts early and when adults encourage and condone such acts by calling it "overkill or a "A real pathetic farce" it should come as no suprise. I wonder what your response would be if the shoe was on the other foot? it saddens me to think my kids might be sharing a playground with others who see them as easy targets.

Silly Sally

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:14 a.m.

While it seems extreme to involve the police over 11-year-olds fighting, it also is extreme to have someone end up in the hospital. When I was a child in a school with similar demographics to Saline, one boy would fight another in an organized fight, after school across the street. As soon as one wanted to stop, admitting defeat, it was over. It was never, ever 2 or 3 against one and I never saw someone hit or kicked while on the ground. The racial thing is a red herring. The real issue is the bullying and the many against one, and the kicking when someone is down. Something is wrong with these boys; I wonder what kind of parental direction they have received? Video games? Movies?

EngineeringMom

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:14 a.m.

For me the bottom line is "Reports indicate more than one student told police the assault was planned during the lunch portion of the hour, and they purposely surrounded the boy on the field to block an adults view." This is blood chilling!

ShadowManager

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9:13 a.m.

Hmmm. Saline is fast becoming the #1 local kickball for soft quasi-news articles on a2dotcom. It started with the "eliminate math class" controversy some months ago, moved through some tawdry school firings and messes, and now this : some kids getting in a fight on the playground! Saline: The Devil's Playground of Washtenaw County. Who woulda thunk it?

engGEEK1988

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 9 a.m.

The lunch supervisors are parent volunteers. I would guess the parents are not aware of the day to day issues with the kids, so they are not on the look out for specific trouble. I am sure the kids knew they could get away with more during the lunch break than a regular recess session. There are also huge problems on the busses in Saline. The busses are over crowded and the older kids are constantly pushing the younger kids around. There really needs to be a monitor on the bus. How can you expect one person to drive a bus and keep all the kids under control? It is a disaster waiting to happen...

KeepingItReal

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:53 a.m.

I have to say that I am pleased the overwhelming number of bloggers, and I assume they are Saline residents have condoned this incident with many of them recognizing the potential racial nature of it. Even the police department apparently recognizes that an offense has occurred. It will be interesting to see how the prosecutor office handles this matter especially since it likes to portray itself as being tough on these types of violations.

Chris

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:36 a.m.

@scooterdog When a parent calls the police to get involved, the police have to take action. Saline police are not ypsilanti where they don't have time to focus on our youth WHEN IT MATTERS the most, no they just wait until it's a lost cause and pick the same guys up weekly for petty crimes. This is a very serious issue that needs to be nipped in the butt.

Chris

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:27 a.m.

@failed2conform Unfortunately our teachers and staff do not have proper training on anticipating conflicts that going to accure. This was an executed plan concocted by peer pressure and persuasion. These are the issues that need to be addressed in our schools, Confidence, integrity, and shame. We need to not coddle our children but get back to the tough love days. Again I believe they should be expelled for their actions to set a standard for Saline Schools, racial or not, it really doesnt matter people.

scooter dog

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:24 a.m.

Wow,Must be real slow at the saline police dept these days,really!charging 11-12 yr olds.This needs to be handled at the schools not the police dept. This has got to be the biggest waste of taxpayer money I have ever heard of. Whats next,you going to charge seniors with jay walking their dogs. A real pathetic farce

a2me2

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:19 a.m.

All the comments I have read here, are focusing on the boys. My question is, where were the lunch supervisors? It appears this incident took some length of time to unfold, from chasing, to grabbing headbands, and then encircling the child. Why aren't these supervisors paying attention? Isn't that their job?

Sandy Castle

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 8:07 a.m.

My children don't go to Saline, they attend Ypsilanti Public schools, but I have to say that I don't believe the district handled this badly at all. It does an injustice to say that the district failed because these kids planned and executed a plan to attack another child. These kids learn their values at home, not at school. Letting the kids out on the playground where they deliberately blocked the view of what was happening from the supervisor was a deliberate choice these kids made to perpetrate their plan. That is not a failure on the school districts' part. My kids (17 and 14) are left to their own devices, unsupervised, quite often and I hope I have taught them better than to make choices to hurt another child and commit criminal acts. That's my job as a parent.

Sandy Castle

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:59 a.m.

Seizures/seizure-like symptoms...I'm sure that the fear that these "seizure-like symptoms" caused to this young victim was probably the same. As an intelligent group we CAN make certain assumptions about the facts in this case, since again we're not the court of law and our judgments are not going to send these children to the juvenile detention center, just from the fact that the police have forwarded a request to charge these individuals. That's why this is called a blog and not a jury box.

failed2conform

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:51 a.m.

@Chris You say it better than me. The kids involved should not be let off easily, but neither should the district. I had a child in Woodland Meadows & Heritage only a few years ago. Teachers - who have received training - let the children out to recess & supervised them. I believe if this was still the case, this situation would have most likely never escalated to the point it did. One of the teachers would have interceded days/weeks before.

engGEEK1988

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:42 a.m.

How sad. It makes me sick thinking what it would be like if this happened to my child.

Jon Saalberg

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:35 a.m.

I think this whole incident is terrible, but you have to ask yourself, if he hadn't had a seizure, would this have every amounted to anything.Uh, the boy had to be treated at a hospital for his injuries - I think to most people, that is serious.

Jimmy Olsen

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:29 a.m.

@Sandy Castle, What I read in the article was "seizure-like symptoms". Maybe you read the medical report and others of us haven't but don't post things like "This child was beaten so badly that he had seizures" unless you know all the facts - and I don't think everyone posting here "knows" all the facts yet - or ever will. I'm confident the authorities (police, school, etc) will handle the situation correctly and I'm hopeful the parents will also accept their responsibility in all of this - beyond the hiring of lawyers.

Rasputin

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 7:17 a.m.

I'm confused, is this not a hate crime because it was racially motivated? I thought that any attack that involved racial attacks was deemed as such and therefore far more severe then just assault charges. Anyone care to clarify?

sellers

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 6:51 a.m.

This kind of activity goes on everywhere. Low income, high income, rural, urban, south, north, young, old, you name it. People make poor decisions sometimes out of peep pressure, poor parenting, emotions, or inexperience. I'm not excusing what happened. I think the Police involvement is appropriate as these kids need to realize it's not Disney and in the end, not everything works out. I too don't believe it was racial but that was used just as any characteristic could be used (slow, short, fat, blonde, etc) Being a parent of Saline children, I can tell you that the majority of students I interact with look down upon racism or signaling out someone based on physical characteristic versus personal characteristics.

Cash

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 6:05 a.m.

Bullying can and has, lead to death. There's no "kids will be kids" about this anymore. And visit a closed head injury facility if you don't think this incident could have had even worse results. Police should absolutely intervene. Children need to learn what is acceptable in our society and some of that sadly will have to come from our law enforcement community, if it doesn't come from family or community. To quote one of my all time favorite philosophers, Barney Fife: "Nip it. Nip it in the bud."

brightonbabe

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 5:53 a.m.

I believe this is an overreaction. If this had happened in my day it would have been a gang of white kids on one white kid. The headmaster/mistress would have been much more involved and would have split the "fight" up taking them all to his/her office, sending the victim to the hospital in an ambulance. Then after his/her own investigation, the guilty parties would have had a required number of strokes of the cane. A short, sharp lesson with no press, police etc. This is going to bring a blast of adverse comments but it worked in every school in the city where I lived. We've become a society of opposites - no corporal puishment but capital punishment is acceptable.

Klly76

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2:16 a.m.

Sounds like the parents are FULLY AWARE of the seriousness of the behavior as they have already contacted "Defense Attorneys". I hope as well they are disciplining the children in the meantime. (Sorry there were a few typos in previous post)

Klly76

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2:14 a.m.

Sonds like the parents are FULLY AWARE of the seriousness of the behabior as they have already contacted "Defense Attorneys". I hope as well they are disciplining the children in the meantime.

janet Bigalke

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2:05 a.m.

I was sad to read this story about these middle school boys. While there might be an issue of race...I think it is more an issue of bullying the perceived "weaker" person. Having raised two children in the Saline Schools, I can say that I was always impressed by the way the school handled these situations...they were always supportive and direct. Let's face it...this comes down to parenting. I would love to know what is going on in the homes of the boys that victimized this student. Were there repercussions at home? Did parents sit down with their sons and talk to them about their behavior and how it was absolutely unacceptable? Were any of the boys required BY THE PARENTS, NOT THE SCHOOL to apologize to the student? Or, are the parents running around defending their child's behavior...he started it, he is "hyper", etc.? Bottom line...it does not matter what this student did or did not do, there is absolutely no excuse for this behavior. The six boys are bullies and whether they are the ring leader or the "sheep" that mindlessly followed, they are all equally to blame.

Klly76

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 2 a.m.

All to often, children are afraid of going to adults/authority in fear of looking like a crybaby. We live in a world where violence is the norm, many parents even teach their children to fight back and not to take crap from other kids doing the bullying. I personally have had experiences where my child (a 9th grader in Belleville schools) has been repeatedly targeted with racial slurs, bullying, and threats to which he did NOT report to an adult or authority figure, only to have the incident escalate and HE is the one that got into trouble for defending himself (nobody at the school was aware of what he had been deling with for several weeks).I talk to him on a regular basis and he understands that two wrongs don't make a right but there is so much pressure from other kids NOT to tell and in the end, who looks like the bad guy??? I think much more emphasis needs to be placed on conflict management/options for children who are constantly being bullied/picked on/harrassed and we need to remove the stigma of "tattle telling" or "snitching" (the new term for those who tell on someone else-which I think is absolutely absurd). My son has been expelled and disciplined for incidents that NEVER had to happen had he just talked to somebody before it came down to this.HAD had he told someone initially, he may not have even gotten into trouble, but once you don't tell, you give soemone else the opportunity to look like the victim. I try so hard to instill values and morals in him (he's 15)but the peer pressure is very strong at this age. My biggest fear is that a small argument/incident could turn into a lifelong tragedy, not only for the children involved, but the families (parents), friends, community and the schools themselves.Kids are so sensitive (even if they don't show it) they just want to be treated like everyone else. I HATE that race has to be a factor in any of this, but unfortunately it's life, and not very many things have changed (as much as they have)for the better. I think the best thing to do as a parent is to STAY involved, drop by the school unexpectedly, keep in touch with teachers/faculty and most importantly we need to figure out ways to provide these children with the tools they need to solve conflict effectively, without it coming to blows. If kids are not equipped with the knowledge of where to go, what to do, and how to be a man(woman)and walk away, what do we expect to happen? Teachers, authority figures, principals can only do so much. It really begins at home and even then without the support of the schools and administration it's a hard situation to deal with, you must be very consistent in your demands as a parent. A lot of these kids don't have role models or two parents and at this age one may feel very lost and alone when put in a situation like this. Even though my son KNOWS he can call me or his father and we will be there in a heartbeat, for some reason he chooses not to do it. It's a very trying time for kids at this age, and WE the parents need to have discussions and talk with our children about whats going on in their schools and try to come up with some better alternatives to handling these issues that are VERY REAL in today's school environments. We can't expect the administrators/teachers and advisors to take on all of these problems on their own. No matter what they are taught in one place, if there is no consistency in other facets of their lives it can be even more confusing. The majority of these kids are good kids, with good hearts, good intentions, they just might stray from the path every once in awhile and it's up to US as a community to be there for them. When I was in Junior high school we had PPI a peer conflict group where kids could get together and express their concerns and come up with solutions to the ones they felt affected them the most. We need programs like that now more than ever, if we can break the kids of their fears, dislike for authority, and make them feel like someone is actually listening, maybe we can accomplish something in the future. I hate to make things into a racial issue, but it is all TOO real, even today sadly. As adults we have alot more coping skills/support/and community & friend support. How about this (due to the Dickinson Elementary school issues regarding race) lets find a way to bring our students (of ALL racial, ethnic, and socionomic backgrounds and help them to learn from each other. My personal feeling is that the MORE you reinforce "I am different than you" the more you are reinforcing just that! It is important to learn about all people from all cultures/races/ethnicity, the more diverse we are, the more we can learn from each other, and the more EVERYONE can benefit from it. This is a perfect opportunity to open a dialogue with our children regarding race issues and inequality and some of the issues that arise from it. Use it to OUR advantage!!! Once we stop "labeling" each other and reinforcing our differences, you will definitely realize we are really not that different, in fact we have more in common than we know! Some of my personal experiences have helped me to realize I actually enjoy learning of other cultures and in a way it makes me much more accepting to learn ones culture with open eyes/arms. Bottom line is no matter what anyone says, these children all want the same thing, to be treated with respect, respected as an individual, and loved...key word "love", boy or girl, it doesnt matter the age, sex, race, religion, we all, even adults strive for those things and we want to make sure our children do also. The one thing I ALWAYS stress to my child is that, a simple fight can just as easily turn into a murder, paralyzation, a life changed FOREVER. I know MOST children truly have no intentions on seriously hurting another. And when we are young, we don't always think about consequences. When something is going on in a child's life we need to teach them to stop, think about the behavior and the consequences and are they REALLY worth it?? Children make choices that can change the rest of their lives without even realizing, and I hope and pray everynight my child will do the right thing. But ultimately as parents, we must continue to stay involved, instill morals and values and most importantly the value of LIFE.THANK GOD this child was ok and did not receive life threatening injuries or life changing trauma which could have changed everything not only for the victim, but for all of those involved. Things are not how they used to be and it's sad, but as we all know the only way to move forward and change lives is to educate ourselves as parents, pass that on down to our children, and PRAY that they will hear us and think twice before making a bad decision. I hope that everyone involved is disciplined accordingly, they need to learn at this age that this behavior is not ok nor is it acceptable. It's downright dangerous, and these kids were VERY lucky that the scenario didn't have a much more devastating/permanent outcome, as this isn't always the case.

Swan1

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 12:44 a.m.

I believe I know these kids. I used to live in Saline, with my nephew. We are people of color, and it was not unusual for my nephew (nine and ten years old at the time) to be called the "N" word by grown men while he was walking or riding his bike, back and forth to school. I admit that my nephew wasn't the best child in school, but he still didn't deserve to be called such derogatory names. One day I was meeting with the principal and I was telling him about my nephew being called the "N" word by grown men, because I was concerned, and it bothered me. His reply was "well, he should just be glad to be here." I'm sure he'll know who I am when (and if he reads this post). There was another person present also. She also knows I'm telling the truth. Saline is not well integrated at all. Some of the children were taught to not like people of color; however, many of the people in Saline are very kind, but some are very prejudiced. I was often afraid for my nephew. I would wait for him at the door or walk up there to meet him after school. I was relieved when we moved away.

LGChelsea

Fri, May 14, 2010 : 12:16 a.m.

What everyone needs to remember here is, besides bullying, this child lost consciousness and had seizures. Doesn't anyone realize that kicking a child in the head multiple times could cause permanent brain damage? Pushing one from behind hard enough that they fall can cause serious injuries to the neck. This child was very lucky he wasn't permanently injured. And the boys involved are also lucky that he wasn't permanently injured! Imagine the outcry if this child didn't recover. Would this still be 'boys will be boys'? Kids suffer closed head injuries and concussions by being repeatedly hit in the head playing sports all the time. Some of the attitudes here are pathetic. I can just imagine if this happened to a child of one of those taking this lightly. Wouldn't THAT change the tone!

Chris

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 11:38 p.m.

How can you generalize saline parents in this? These kids made horrible decisions, but saline parents as are a strong, well educated, and supportive group that will band together in this time of trial. Ann Arbor schools has cases not just like this every week but similar involving only a couple of students at a time. Im not saying that this would not have been a big deal elsewhere, but the bases of this situation are NOT uncommon. Young boys having problems with one another, what scares me is the elaborate plan. Dudley, Im sorry to say sir but you have not right to blame saline parents as a whole. Where are you from, Im sure your schools have issues just like any other. Do you even have KIDS? OR do you just blog about issues you know nothing of?

Chris

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 11:26 p.m.

My wife and I moved to saline for the community, it truly is a great place to live. Unfortunately this smell will stick with us for a long time. This situation is sad but real, we influence our kids everyday to make the right decisions upon reaction. I dont believe in this case it was racial; its idiotic to believe all this could happen over a look of another when one of their own was the same. Shame on Saline schools for not doing a conflict resolution with these kids and their parents. These kids should be expelled, We have a zero tolerance policy and I Plan on making sure this is upheld.

ArthGuinness

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 9:51 p.m.

@a2citizen, who said, "... 25% involved (for better or worse) were black. Saline appears to be much more diverse than Ann Arbor." Huh? So we can judge diversity by a random selection of eight people? Somebody needs a class in statistics.

SalineMom

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 9:33 p.m.

@Kelly "This child, and many others that occurred this year is proof." Many others of what that occurred this year? Do you have solid facts and figures, or are you just adding to the speculation of events like other posters on this board?

aareader

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 9:25 p.m.

Such a sad story. I have a 10 year old son, and I would be so ashamed if he was involved in something like this. I don't care if the victim (or assailant) is black, white, or purple, no one deserves to be treated like that. Stop defending the boys who assaulted the victim, so what if things like this happened in the past. Too many times nowadays, the argument is "you did it, so I can too". Sorry, two wrongs don't make a right.

sh1

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 9:17 p.m.

a2citizen: Surely you know small sample sizes have large margins of error. Statistics 101.

failed2conform

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 9:10 p.m.

This story is pathetic. A race issue? Possibly. Do we really need to involve the police with 11 year-olds? And the folks at the school to whom we must trust our children's safety (and failed) skip free? Won't Saline Area Schools please accept the responsibility they claimed?

whyohwhy

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:58 p.m.

Santino..it was at a 5th/6th grade building not the Middle School. I think that fact makes it more shocking.

a2citizen

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:49 p.m.

@pmarie. 6 white assailants, 1 black assailant. 1 black victim. A total of 8 students. My math shows that 25% involved (for better or worse) were black. Saline appears to be much more diverse than Ann Arbor.

ronaldduck

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:39 p.m.

I would not refuse to allow the police to talk to my child as long as I was there to observe the interview. I think maybe to many parents coddle their children and don't make them take responsibility for their actions. Possibly some time time spent in juvenile court will do them some good.

Kelly

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:12 p.m.

The SAS administration is having a public discussion on safety in the SAS schools on Monday 5/17 at Pleasant Ridge Elementary. It's time to get serious and let them know just how inadequate safety has been this year. This child, and many others that occurred this year is proof.

santino

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:10 p.m.

What a shame! 7 against 1? And in middle school. Damn shame.

KeepingItReal

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 7:07 p.m.

It's amazing that the response to this incident and the one that happened in Saline's neighboring community is totally different and low keyed. As one of the a2.com bloggers pointed out: if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck and behaves like a duck, its probably a duck.

scooter dog

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 6:48 p.m.

Boys will be boys,talk about overkill,but the victim is black so if it were a white boy we would not be talking about this here,right?

j

Thu, May 13, 2010 : 6:48 p.m.

I think this whole incident is terrible, but you have to ask yourself, if he hadn't had a seizure, would this have every amounted to anything. But, he did. It's all a little "Lord of the Flies" for me. I am hesitant to lay blame anywhere here because it really belongs just about everywhere. Parents, recess monitors, teachers and school administrators could all do more. It's hard to lay just one finger on the problem. On top of all that, while this is going on, they are reducing the number of counselors who are supposed to be watching for these kinds of problems. Saline Schools genuinely cares about the well being of their students and they take it seriously. Only time will tell if this is an aberration or a pattern.