Posted on Mon, May 7, 2012 : 5:53 p.m.
Milan residents voice discontent over school board's decision to change mascot
By Pete Cunningham
The decision by Milan Area Schools to drop all Native American imagery and develop a replacement Big Reds mascot has upset some former Big Reds, according to a Milan News-Leader report.
Native American imagery has already been removed from some team uniforms, such as the Milan High School boys basketball jerseys.
Though the resolution does not call for changing of the Big Reds name, Kanaley sees the Native American imagery as a vital part of the school's tradition and argues it is used in a positive connotation.
Comments
catmi
Wed, May 9, 2012 : 12:07 a.m.
Oh for pitys sake, just change the image to a big red rooster. Then you won't have to change the name. I live here and it's not like this town is papered in the image, usually it's just the name. It's just a name. And please drop the whole "Native American/Indian" stuff. It only starts people jumping on soap boxes and shouting matches. To do so over this, instead of wars,or politics, or the care of children and the elderly, is beneath us. If there's a problem, then the actual Native American Nation (or whatever the correct term is) will deal with it, not us. And complaining about it (the use of images) won't suddenly change all of it . We've had hundreds of years to become educated, and hundreds more ahead of us... no one is the final word on this and no one has a right to make that claim. I don't think history will really care about small towns like Milan and whether or not an image was of historic relevance. Yes, I think what happened hundreds of years ago is an atrocity and a nightmare who's depth and breadth are beyond the scope of a single mans ability to even imagine. Don't ever doubt my respect for that, or my shame that a human could inflict that on another human. I have family on both sides who were of Native American Descent, including one who survived The Trail of Tears, and I could personally not care about this particular aspect of how Native American Rights are being examined. My energy is spent elsewhere when it comes to how a person or people are treated by another.
OLDTIMER3
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 5:55 p.m.
Did anyone ask any Native Americans what they think about all of this ?
Mike S
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 5:33 p.m.
The way I understand it is many Native Americans don't feel honored by being conquered, oppressed, and stereotyped. http://aistm.org/fr.faqs.htm
Kristen
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 4:36 p.m.
Lets be realistic here, all of come from different walks of life. The majority of people can find something horrible that happen to their ancestors whether you are Native American, Black, White, Polish, Mexican, Asian, etc. These things that happen cause pain and nobody should ever forget that. With that said, at some point you have to let go of the past and move forward. Do we really expect the future generations to not have certain mascots because of something horrible that happened in the past? If that is the case then every name of every food chain, sports team, company, store, etc. would have to be changed because I promise you if you want to do the research you can find something offensive in everything. What I find funny is that we teach our children to treat everyone the same, at least any good parent would do so, yet we are telling them to treat Native American's differently because of the past? I don't get it. I went to Milan Schools my entire life, and those who want to make the jokes of Milan Education can do so but I am a happy, successful person who is proud to have been a "Big Red" for many years. During sports events it was shouted with pride! I can only wish that some of the pain my ancestors went through would be honored in such a way!
Ron Granger
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 2:47 p.m.
I find the double standards expressed by those who defend the misappropriation and distortion of native imagery disgusting. For those who think it is okay, would you also support team mascots and imagery fixated on other racial stereotypes? I would list some examples to further reinforce my point, but I think my post would be removed.
Ron Granger
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 8:51 p.m.
For what other racial or ethnic groups do you claim it would be appropriate for a sports team to use for marketing and branding purposes?
Hot Sam
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 3:28 p.m.
I would like to see an example of "negative" imagery...any thing I recall seeing is respectful and honoring...
lumberg48108
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 2:52 p.m.
Isn't it really open to interpretation? What offends some does not offend others and so on ... this are not absolutes we are dealing with. This is not black-letter law and if we are being honest, this is a small portion of the reality in which we live. We will all survive one way or the other. My comment (above yours) demonstrates how, in some cases, those that are being discsussed have a different viewpoint than those supposedly speaking for them. Why are some voices "right" and some others not worth listening too?
lumberg48108
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 2:27 p.m.
When EMU changed the name more than 20 years ago, real Huron natives were brought in to talk to the university explain how they wanted EMU to keep the name and they thought it was honoring them, not insulting them of course, those voices fell on deaf ears as the PC movement was gaining momentum at the time so voices for the change matter, voices against it have no say - even if they are the ones being discussed funny how that works AND -- EMU compounded the fracture by instituting the most generic nickname in america - a name alums that were Hurons were not even utter to this day
catmi
Wed, May 9, 2012 : 12:22 a.m.
I remember that, I was a student then, we were all angry about it and when students found out the Huron's didn't want EMU to change it, we were up in arms. When Big Wigs did come up with that cheesy looking bird (that looks like something out of a fried chicken restaurant) they had to allow any graduating student that was enrolled prior to the change the choice to have the Huron Logo engraved on their class ring (it was the best they could come up with). It was kind of fun to stand under that dumb mascot and order my ring. Sorry new guy, your ring looks like something out of a gumball machine.
Hot Sam
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:27 p.m.
The ultimate respect someone can offer is to name their team after you...
dexterreader
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:59 p.m.
Once a Huron, always a Huron. Once a Brave, always a Brave. Once a Big Red, always a Big Red. 'Nuff said.
JSA
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:55 p.m.
Time to throw out of office those who voted for the change. This should be a litmus test for the next election. Why is it than when someone gets elected to office political correctness takes over? You'd think it was Ann Arbor. Put it to a vote of the people, not some selfserving elected official.
Chip Reed
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:07 p.m.
Well, how about honoring the dragstrip? The Milan Drag Kings (and Milan Drag Queens) would work. I'm a big fan of the Dexter Dreadnaughts with their fierce little battleship logo...
catmi
Wed, May 9, 2012 : 12:16 a.m.
Yup, but I gotta tell you, as a former Dreadnaught, the most common question from visiting student rivals was "what the hell is a dreadnaught?" And don't ask me about cheerleaders trying to spell it in their cheers. I think they should add something beneath it like... "Unsinkable!" or some thing of some sort. I didn't know what it was for the first part of my freshman year!
Ron Granger
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 2:41 p.m.
Nice. Very nice.
Chip Reed
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:02 p.m.
Perhaps the new name could reference the major employer in town (the Federal Penitentiary). The Milan Screws, The Milan Felons, The Milan Correctional Officers, etc. I have a friend who lives in Little Ferry, New Jersey. What should their sports teams be called?
Dennis Hill
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 11:36 a.m.
This subject is so offbase! A school mascot is not a way to disrespect anything. A school mascot is a way the school can show school pride. If anything the term "Big Reds" is a way of showing respect to Native American culture. Now if a rival school says something negative about the school using "Big Reds" in that expression, then I can understand. Before anyone wants to jutmp all over me about this, let me pre-empt by saying this; I have "Native American" blood running through my body! Go "Braves"!! YHS 85 Go "Big Reds"!! Two kids enrolled now.
Native Rights
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 3:44 a.m.
These people are obviously a product of the Milan educational system... what a shame they are so ignorant about Native American issues. Would changing their name to the "Big Blacks" and having an image of an African-American man be an acceptable logo? Of course it wouldn't...just as it is not acceptable to call themselves the "Big Reds" and have an image of a Native American as a logo. Get a grip Milan...it was the Native Americans who lost their traditions and heritage years ago. It's about time you gave Native Americans this small token of respect.
dading dont delete me bro
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 2:39 a.m.
it happened in ypsilanti, now our mascot lacks any sense of history. DON'T let it happen. i have NO connection with a phoenix other than a trans am hood decal. it happened at emu. DON'T let it happen. pure stupidity to let it change
sports nut
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:47 a.m.
I really am confused on how a FEW can dictate a change that has never hurt anyone? I have always remembered when the national anthem is sung at YHS they always shouted "Home of the Braves" now they can't have that school spirit anymore in that way. That is sad in it's self and you have taken away that part of school spirit. I think some people are bored and need to toot their own horn. I wish they would used that energy in a positive way to figure out how to save schools money and build education, leave tradition alone if it is positive.
Ron Granger
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:21 a.m.
We need to have a "choose the mascot" contest. Any suggestions?
jcj
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:46 a.m.
Milan "Marshmallows" better suited for the administrators Milan "Marauders" nope glorifies outlaws Milan "Merry Men" nope offensive to Gays Milan "Mountaineers" nope disrespects Sir Edmund Hillary Milan 'Mariners" nope disrespects Christopher Columbus
Ivor Ivorsen
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:45 a.m.
Anne English wrote: "Keeping tribal names for sports teams helps preserve history for their areas of the country, such as the Florida State Seminoles. It makes it easier to remember which tribe lived where" ...or you could read a book and learn about the amazing and tragic history of native peoples of the American Southeast and understand why they don't live there anymore (they're in Okalahoma). Using team mascots based on racial stereotypes to "remember" a people is kinda like using a box of Frosted Flakes to learn about tigers.
Ivor Ivorsen
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:32 a.m.
xmo wrote: "It reminds Americans of what made this country great! The clash of cultures, ideas and how we blended together to form a Union." Oh, yes, people really got "blended" at places like Wounded Knee, South Dakota (1890) and Sand Creek, Colorado (1864). Loads of American greatness!
Justine Robinson
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:21 p.m.
I understand why their is backlash from the community to changing the Native American mascot, I think it is a very respected mascot and should be used throughout schools, but only if it is used in the proper context. For example the Milan High school mascot "Big Reds" is pretty discriminatory in my mind because of the use of context describing Native Americans as "Reds", a derogatory term that I feel should not represent this race. Think of the outrage that would come to the school or any school if their mascot name was "Big Blacks" and "Big Yellows" and people defending the name just because of the tradition behind it. I understand school loyalty and defending it and looking at the facebook page, I think the members have their best judgement in mind and want to respect Native American culture. Anyways, I think the school board should have changed the mascot name and kept the mascot with the local tribe or Native American affiliation that was part of the decision's permission .
Forever27
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:12 p.m.
@cinnabar, the fact that you don't even know that "reds" is a derogatory name shows your ignorance on this issue.
cinnabar7071
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:04 p.m.
"Reds", is derogatory? Since when? Is that the thoughts that come into your mind? Scary
Loopy
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:04 a.m.
I made that point above. Also, "Big Blacks" doesn't even come close to analagous. What if the team were called "The Big Darkies"? No one would put up with that, "historical" or not. Somehow, any time Native Americans object to anything, they're accused of political correctness without even listening to why they feel that way.
jcj
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:11 p.m.
They can now be known as the Milan wimps!
Ann English
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:02 p.m.
I always understood that naming teams after Indians was a way to honor the Indians for their bravery. When EMU traded their Huron Indian tribe name away, they substituted an animal that Indians killed in order to get their feathers to wear. Keeping tribal names for sports teams helps preserve history for their areas of the country, such as the Florida State Seminoles. It makes it easier to remember which tribe lived where.
Loopy
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:29 a.m.
Hurons is different from Big Reds, don't you think? I guess if you can't tell the difference, go ahead and keep your dimes.
stunhsif
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 1:23 a.m.
Not to mention that the remaining Huron tribe implored EMU to keep the name "Hurons" as they felt EMU had always been respectful in honoring their legacy. Since they changed their name, I have never given them a dime. ABO
Loopy
Tue, May 8, 2012 : 12:18 a.m.
Isn't it odd how we have to wonder if it honors them or not, because nobody listens to them anyway?
Topher
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:08 p.m.
This is an interesting perspective. I feel like we need to also think of it from the perspective of Native American groups. I wonder if area Native American groups would feel that it honors them?
xmo
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 10:51 p.m.
Does the name really disrespect or offend any race or people? It reminds Americans of what made this country great! The clash of cultures, ideas and how we blended together to form a Union. Now Milan High Mascot will be Brand X, Home of the Bland and Boring! Way to go School Board!
Loopy
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:10 p.m.
Would you feel the same way if the team was called "The Big Blacks"?
Topher
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:09 p.m.
Ooh! I kind of really like Brand X as a mascot. I'd like to add this to my list above.
HONDO
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 10:41 p.m.
Should have been changed 100 years ago, too bad we would rather keep the name and disrespect the people it does. But hey alum from '87 should really have a say in 2012. I thought we were in solace in America that we realize how we screwed the native Americans and should respect their choice and drop the imagery. Simple minds don't rule the world anymore!
jcj
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:09 p.m.
"should respect their choice and drop the imagery" And how many want to drop it? Funny you choose the screen name Hondo played by John Wayne who killed as many Native Americans in his films as anyone!
jcj
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:03 p.m.
"Simple minds don't rule the world anymore!" Nope they just post on Mlive!
Topher
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 11:01 p.m.
@southyoop - I feel like there is a difference when it's a current societal group that perhaps does not want to be portrayed as a mascot, especially one with a past complicated by violence, colonialism, and oppression. There are so many other options that would make awesome mascots (shout out to Santa Cruz Banana Slugs!). Let's get creative folks! Proposals (may be used): Milan Binary Code, Milan Tart Cherries, Milan Great Lakes, Milan Bleeding Hearts, Milan Unicorns.
southyoop
Mon, May 7, 2012 : 10:47 p.m.
Yep, you're right. We should just drop all sport mascot names that might offend someone....Vikings, Patriots, Texans, Cowboys. Maybe all the animal rights people think we should drop the Bears, Lions, Wolverines, Eagles, etc.