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Posted on Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 3:37 p.m.

School and police officials investigating Ann Arbor high school football brawl

By Paula Gardner

Previous coverage:

Officials at Ann Arbor Public Schools are spending the weekend investigating the on-field brawl between Pioneer and Huron high schools teams on Friday night.

The district's investigation - led by both principals and athletic directors - coincides with an Ann Arbor Police Department investigation into the incident, which resulted in claims of assault and at least one student injured.

"This is a really appalling situation," said Liz Margolis, spokeswoman for the Ann Arbor Public Schools. "This is not how a coaching staff should lead student athletes."

The district's investigation started immediately after the game, Margolis said, since the officials were on-site.

The group will meet with administration on Monday to determine the next steps.


Multiple fights broke out on the field involving players and coaches after the Huron vs. Pioneer football game on Friday.

Daniel Brenner |

"We'll be taking appropriate action with students and staff," Margolis said.

Information on whether any employment circumstances have been changed among staff involved in the situation was not available Saturday.

"We don't comment on that," Margolis said. "I don't believe any action will be taken until Monday. ... after the investigation is compete."

One student sought treatment for a cut to his face after the game, and no additional complaints of injuries from the incident have been brought to the district's attention, Margolis said.

Meanwhile, Ann Arbor police are reviewing the incident for possible criminal charges. At least four officers were stationed at the game, Margolis said, which is typical for the size of the crowd anticipated for the game.

“What we’re doing right now is we’re going to actively investigate and look at the various footage and photos like that to see what started this,” Ann Arbor police Lt. Renee Bush said following Friday's game.

As of Saturday morning, Bush said no new information was available concerning the investigation, only that investigators would be reviewing the tapes of the fight early next week before proceeding with any sort of criminal charges.

Following the fight, Bush and other officers took statements from witnesses including the young man injured in the brawl and his family.

Videos of the fight have not been made available.

The stands for the game at Riverbank Stadium were not filled. Margolis said an official count for attendance was not available.

Huron came into the game without a victory this season, while Pioneer was expecting a win as it headed toward possible playoff contention.

Yet the two teams still feel a hometown rivalry, Margolis said, dating from the years when they were the district's only two high schools fielding sports teams.

"They're crosstown rivals, but also friends crosstown," she said. "It's a sad situation to see something like this get out of hand."



Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 2:02 a.m.

Nobody was forced out on to the field to get this fight going. When one chooses to jump in and then gets an owwwy they should quit whining and pick your fights a little better next time.

A Voice of Reason

Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:49 a.m.

My advice to this community is to move on. Professional hockey teams are fighting all the time and this does not make it right, and yes, we do expect better from our high school coaches and players. Obviously, this was a huge mistake for everyone involved. It seems like the energy of the staff at the AAPS and its students should be spend on reading and writing vs. reliving the fight for the next two weeks. Football is a rough sport full of violence. Sorry this happened, but pick a less violent sport for your kids.

A Voice of Reason

Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:41 a.m.

Well, this is what we get for giving everyone on the team a trophy for participation. The University of Michigan is not worried about the score against their opponents, why should high school sports be any different. In tennis, golf, swimming, etc., no one is worried about how badly they are winning. The loosing team can say...we stop play and give up. I agree with the feelings of the Huron Coach and being upset about Pioneer running up the score, but you can say...we quit--but, coaches think that is giving up and would rather dumb down the score. Yes, loosing is not fun, but you do learn from loosing. Being entitled to loose by a certain, fair amount is strange to me and is not teaching anything. And, to have a full out fight over this issue is unbelievable.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 10:42 a.m.

"Toughen up"? Do you think that attitude works in the real world?

A Voice of Reason

Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:58 a.m.

Then, do not play sports because the object is to win. Loosing, no matter by how much, is not fun and who is setting the line for what is "humiliating". The fact that parents see loosing as "humiliating" is exactly why the coaches became outraged by the score. Tennis players pride themselves in winning 6-0, 6-0 and are not concerned about their opponent's score for one minute and yes, their opponent is humiliated too. Toughen up!


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:49 a.m.

Indeed, it's not much better than bullying.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:48 a.m.

Try to remember that football is (supposed to be) a game and that it is (supposed to be) played for fun. Running up the score is really kicking someone when he's down, which is to say cruel, and, more importantly, unnecessary. School athletics are promoted by claiming that they teach life skills, but humiliating someone just because you can is not exactly a skill that yields dividends in the real world.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:16 a.m.

Again, I ask....where is our superintendent? Doesn't she have any comment?


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 1:46 a.m.

She's in Pennsylvania...


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 11:56 p.m.

Hey's Gildersleeve treating you?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 8:26 p.m.

When I pay to send my River Rats to a game, I'm not expecting a night at the fights. Not a good example for my teens. Being on staff is not just about teaching a subject or coaching a sport, it is about building character. Thank you to the majority of staff at Huron, including my neighbors on both sides, who do step up!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 8:10 p.m.

Here's what Rick Telander, a columnist for the Chicago Sun-Times and a former scholarship football player at Northwestern, says about football: "Big time college football coaches like to profess that they are building proper, upstanding, freethinking, superior men at the same time they are building football players, when that is clearly not the case. Far from socializing their players, coaches all too often shape them into young me with warped perspectives on obedience, morality, and competition who are often unable to function appropriately in the real world....[M]uch of the football rhetoric doled out by coaches is nothing but third-rate psychological pap sprinkled with cliches that have only the slightest basis in everyday life. Slogans that are useful in a primitive game like football--'Never surrender,' 'The most aggressive player wins,' 'Intimidation earns respect'--can be downright harmful in normal society where restraint, compromise, and cooperation are more typical ways of moving in the daily game....All the things the coaches hammered into [a] player's brain will have to be expunged once he sets out on the street. Indeed, it is remarkable how many former players that I have talked to imply that _forgetting_ about their coaches was one of the major steps they had to take to get on with their lives....But the coaches aren't really concerned about the long-range effects of their teachings, because the coaches are rooted in the here and now. They know they are far better off winning with antisocial people than losing with well-adjusted ones." Source: _The Hundred Yard Lie_, 1996 edition, pp. 86-103. While Telander was writing about college football, I think some of his points apply to high school football as well.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 6:07 p.m.

Do you think that the elimination of the school police officer might have affected this situation......Just an observation, but if the officer had been at the school, he or she may have "heard" that there may be problems well before the game.......


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 7:54 p.m.

observer - There were 4 police officers at the game, assigned to be there for crowd control. The school officer would not have been a 5th, the staffing level is 4.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:25 p.m.

This is way beyond an AAPS or MHAA issue. This is a legal issue of the highest priority, involving criminal acts of violence. No arrests? Ann Arbor and Michigan will now be in the national spotlight, and it is critical that the legal system operates swiftly and holds everyone accountable to the maximum penalties provided by law. This is equivalent to domestic violence action/law, except that those responsible are the coaches, staff, and leaders/athletes. Each and everyone involved (the students/athletes and staff/coaches) should be identified on video, arrested, charged and processed according to the law. This is way beyond the policy jurisdiction of the superintendant, administrators, board, principal, athletic director, and staff. This is plain and simple an act of assault and battery, to be dealt with by the law, with the maximum penalties applied up to and including criminal penalties and jail/prison time. You can be sure that our zero tolerance policy and law for domestic violence is a model here. If we do anything short of charging and prosecuting everyone involved, then we will see this again in the future. If everyone who was guilty of fighting is charged with criminal assault and battery, without any "easy judgements" we are sure this kind of thing won't happen again. Ann Arbor and Michigan is now in the national spotlight, and it is critical that the legal system operates responsibly and holds everyone accountable to avoid a repeat. If Ann Arbor schools hired responsible staff and coaches, then the staff and coaches need to stand up to the challenge and admit their guild and accept the maximum penalty provided by law. This will ensure Michigan schools and the rest of the country will not see this kind of incident again.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 6:47 p.m.

National news! You really think that the New York Times will run a story on a high school football squabble? MSNBC will not cover this fisticuff nor will Fox News. This is really small time brawling over a little issue for running up a score and embarrassing the losers. South Park or Family Guy may pick up on it. Oh yea South Park just did an episode on "Sarcastaball." A little blood, small foul, shake hands, and play nicer.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 4:43 p.m.

Friday Night Lights Out. The Ann Arbor version.

Claude Kershner

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 4:11 p.m.

The most desired outcome for this horrible display between both Huron and Pioneer will be a complete re-evalution for all of the sports programs in Ann Arbor. The path forward for this particular instance of adults behaving badly is clear: Fire the Huron Head Coach and the Pioneer Assistant Coach. Suspsend the Head Coach for Pioneer for the rest of the season for advancing a season long program of retribution and humilation (69-0 vs. Dexter? Are you kidding me?) and then the weak excuse of claimed ignorance about his offensive play selection Friday. He is either lying or not in charge. Neither is acceptable. The football debachle, however, is reflective of a greater concern and issue that pervades ALL of Varsity level sports in Ann Arbor. Accros multiple sports and schools we have seen first hand both students and parents behaving with unsportsmanlike conduct both on the field, court or pool and off. It begins with a lack of standards for honesty and accountability for the basic premise of player eligibility. For DECADES Ann Arbor Public Schools have turned a blind eye to allow talented players from outside of the Ann Arbor district falsify places of residence in order to play. It is a short walk to go from lying about where you live and sleep (Which sends a message to your team and to your school community) to running up the score to settle a perceived debt with another team to fighting at mid field. When one basic standard is repeatedly violated without punishment the bar is lowered, the standards of accetable ethics is compromised and the very worst of conduct becomes a regular part of the athletic experience for all people involved.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 9:22 p.m.

Pioneer would have had to start taking a knee at the start of the 3rd quarter. Their last score was a Dexter fumble that was returned for a TD in the 4th quarter. That's not football. You can't tell kids not to play. The 'perceived debt' you refer to was one hyped by, not by the head coach of Pioneer, who never coached at Dexter, nor by the assistant who did. Where was all this caterwauling when Pioneer, Saline, and Chelsea were beating up on Dexter 8 years ago by scores of 60-whatever to very few? The fact is, Pioneer was coming off losses to two of the top teams in the state and were hungry for their first win and Dexter has been no match for any team this year.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:24 p.m.

Mr. Sullivan - In sports, teams routinely take a knee at the end of a game when they are way ahead, and don't run up the scores. This is done at the professional level, the college level and the high school level. Even in Peewee football there are "mercy" rules to avoid running up the score. In many years of playing sports, teams I was a member of routinely did the right thing and did not run up the score at the end of the game, this was especially true of our rivals, nothing good could come of running up the score on someone we had a long history of playing.

Charley Sullivan

Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 6:10 a.m.

Dexter lost my nearly 10 touchdowns. They were outclassed. What do you want him to do, put in the JV? If you're teaching a team to play hard, you ask them to play hard, no matter what the circumstances. Is the kid with the ball NOT supposed to go at his fullest effort? Is the kid blocking for him just supposed to let a guy go by? If there are sportsmanship issues with parents, in the stands, etc., then address them. But asking athletes to back off isn't sporting. Go hard or go home.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 4:15 a.m.

Athletic leadership starts with the AD. It has cleary failed in Ann Arbor for both Pioneer and Huron. This would not have happened if the AD's were already in control. The problem is, they're not in control. This was proven on Friday night. They don't know what's important. The coaches acted out because they thought they could. Install better leaders at the top, and you'll have better behavior at the bottom.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:12 p.m.

Would make for interesting investigative reporting to look into this "falsifying places of residence in order to play". Granted it would take a lot of digging, but it would be more interesting than say, "pet of the week", lol.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 2:51 p.m.

I still say "no big deal." Concussions, heart problems, and dehydration for the players are a much bigger concern to me than a few punches being thrown. Injuries were minimal in comparison to many schools that have lost students to sports accidents. Maybe no tackling and playing with a balloon and being nice to each other would be a better game.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:09 p.m.

I wasn't there, and don't know what happened to spark the conflict, but think it doesn't really matter who started the trash-talking or whatever was the first incident. It's clear that players/staff on both sides were involved. There need to be serious consequences for both sides to make it clear that this cannot ever happen again, and that it doesn't matter if you think the other side started it -- you can't take part.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:54 p.m.

Picture of the person who threw the crutch!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 11:34 a.m.

Was there any doo-tie left on the field? I seem to remember the class prank a year or two ago. I don't know that sportsmanship is any better or worse than it was "back in the day" as many commenters here have romanticized.

Jeff Punch

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 11:03 a.m.

My bias is that sports are important for a variety of reasons. However, I am concerned about deteriorating sportsmanship among athletes at all levels. I think it is something that people involved with youth athletics need to take seriously or the benefits of sports on both character and health will be a distant memory.

Chris Blackstone

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 10:56 a.m.

If even half of the comments on all the fight articles were from people using their real names, then maybe the discussion would be profitable or even encouraging. Instead, it's a bunch of half truths lobbed from the security, or cowardice, of anonymity. staff, it's time to think about requiring people to use their real names to comment. If all it did was get rid of the trolls and brought some civility to the conversation, it would be a great improvement. I look forward to hearing Huron AD Dottie Davis' comments on this incident. I had her for multiple classes are Huron where she was a prepared leader and guide. I don't doubt that she will address this situation appropriately to ensure that it never happen again.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 4:08 a.m.

It didn't happen before her "watch." Other AD's, before her, made sure it didn't happen. But, it did happen during her "watch." There's a good way to make sure it doesn't happen, again...install a leader with a successful background of being an AD where this kind of scene didn't happen, before.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 12:32 a.m.

Gildersleeve has a history of blowing up on the field...I certainly would LOVE to hear Dottie's comments. BUT, being that it would deal with employee discipline, I am confident it won't hit the paper.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 8:43 p.m.

YEP!! sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE" "TERMINATE BOTH TEAMS SEASONS" Apparently none of these people have heard of a due process of doing true fact finding before making rational decisions.

Ricardo Queso

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 2:03 p.m.

I agree!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 6:20 a.m.

Secrecy prevails......parents and students take a back seat to employees as usual.

Terry Star21

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:30 a.m.

The Ann Arbor Public Schools will take the oppropriate steps after a though investigation - this you can be assured of. From all accounts that we have heard so far, it would appear (allegedly) that everything began with the two head coaches meeting. Something happened verbally (maybe physically) at that point which instigated this brawl. If this is a true, it is a very sad case of educational leaders conduct. Teachers and coaches teach by example, they teach our kids with impeccable behaviour traits. There should be an unwritten (or written) 'no tollerance' policy of behaviour for teachers/coaches (although the MEA protects teachers, or coaches that teach). If the A2 administration finds that it is true, that one or both of these coaches were responsible for this brawl - one or both should be fired. Adults strive and sacrifice for their children to make sure they are safe. I feel for the young man that was injured, and it is a miracle more weren't injured or any more serious injuries occured. There should be a zero tolerance policy for those adults, if guilty.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 1:49 p.m.

Not fired, just disciplined. For an offense this extreme I can see and extended, unpaid leave of absence for the coaches. And neither team should finish the season; no more games. The MEA should protect the rights of these workers to keep their jobs. If we go with a "no tolerance" policy, then coaches should be offered jobs, as available in other positions that they qualify for whether as faculty or staff.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:14 p.m.

"The Ann Arbor Public Schools will take the oppropriate steps after a though investigation - this you can be assured of" Are you new around these parts, lol? Just kidding ;)

Kai Petainen

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:14 a.m.

i'm not sure where to say this.... but this has NOT been a slow news weekend for the ann arbor news. the amount of comments for a variety of topics has been staggering. amazing job. my hats off to the ann arbor news for the work they did this week.

Kyle Mattson

Thu, Oct 18, 2012 : 3:48 p.m.

Thanks Kai.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 3:43 a.m.

The adults lost control. They will be punished. The kids who followed that lead and lost control will be also be punished. Worse things have happened than a brush up after a high school football game. This will be handled accordingly. No one will get away with a thing. Sports does not breed psychopaths. But you do need right leaders to teach kids life lessons via athletics. These adults failed, but is in no one a reflection on all athletics. When problem arises, you take care of it. Doesn't matter what town it is. Take a step back or off your soap box and stop using an unfortunate incident to chip in snide off subject comments. Here's hoping real adults who are respectable men and women teach these kids a valuable lesson.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 3:02 a.m.

And both AA schools. Hmmm...Where are all the Ypsi schools and residents are nothing but thugs comments now?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:25 a.m.

Send in the clowns.

Unusual Suspect

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:15 a.m.

Any football coach that gets that upset about losing by 29 needs to consider a new line of work.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:27 p.m.

I have learned over the last four years that the coach definitely needs to pursue a new line of work. Now he will have that opportunity.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:26 a.m.

I know...when I first started reading the articles about the incident, I assumed the score was something like 60-0!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:22 a.m.

Kind of ironic, the Ypsilanti vs. Lincoln game last night was conducted last night with no incidents.

Charley Sullivan

Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 6:05 a.m.

You mean the game in the "dangerous" part of the county?? hehehe


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:21 a.m.

What was the score of the game?

Buck Wild

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:21 p.m.

Thank you, Goofus. You made my morning.

Paula Gardner

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:46 a.m.

Pioneer won, 35-6


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:40 p.m.

I'm a little surprised that so many people are judging these kids so harshly. I wonder if anyone remembers what it is like to be a high school student and pumped full of hormones and pressure and loyalty. Players are often very, very loyal to each other and to their coach. So when you see a coach taking a shot at your coach, do you really think that the players are not going to jump in there?? Heck, I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the parents and spectators jumped in, yet so many here want to crucify the athletes only. It's obvious that some folks here don't want any spending on sports, period. Got that, because you're a broken record. But every study out there suggests that sports are a great influence on students. Yes, this was horribly stupid all around, but condemning everyone and every sport is uncalled for. Worried about fighting - pop into any middle school or high school and you'll be treated to a daily fight -- fights that have nothing to do with athletics.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 2:07 p.m.

I agree with CLX. I didn't get into a lot of fights as a kid, as I chose diplomacy when I could. But I did get into a few, about half of which were unavoidable. On the other half, I was a teenager, what can I say. No one really wins in fights, but they happen because they are part of life. Just like with animals, when we get angry our ability to think rationally drops like you cannot even believe. That's why it's best to cool off before having/continuing important discussions or disciplining people.

Unusual Suspect

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:14 a.m.

I do remember. And I never got into fights, on or off the field.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:32 a.m.

If high school sports teaches unquestioned loyalty, I want nothing to do with it.


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:34 p.m.

Playing sports builds character. This kind.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 7:33 p.m.

Are you referring to me? A person about which you know virtually nothing? Did you learn rhetoric in football practice?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:25 p.m.

I agree with Mike. Not playing sports seems to make some peiople very self righteous. And judgemental.

mike gatti

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 3:44 a.m.

That's really unfair. Not playing sports must make people self righteous know it alls

J. A. Pieper

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:19 p.m.

I personally know the PHS coach and this is never something he would condone. Those who say fire everyone involved should wait until more information is shared, if that is ever possible with Ann Arbor Public Schools. They will do their best to cover up every incident.


Tue, Oct 16, 2012 : 8:47 p.m.

I agree with you, J.A. Pieper. I met Paul Test some years ago while he was working in another capacity for AAPS. Throughout the time he was in that role, his comportment was never anything but exemplary and we miss having him at our kids' school. He is a very classy person who is probably caught in a tangle right now. What is disheartening to me is to read the comments about how the actions on the field toward the end of the game were not his call. He is the head coach. What is going on within Pioneer football that drives this lack of following authority? I know he loves football. Maybe he can coach at another school where conditions are better.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 8:45 p.m.

Is this the same honorable PHS coach that kicked an onside kick against a helpess dexter team when the game was already out of hand? i think he might not be such a good guy.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:23 p.m.

Since when did sportsmanship dictate that a team stop playing? Gildersleeve should have been coaching his kids to stop Pioneer instead of yelling at Pioneer. In four years he obviously has made no progress in building a program. The track record proves that he and his assistants don't know how to coach. He and his staff need to be gone. And the Pioneer assistant that made the first blow should be gone before Monday. Hopefully he will have bigger issues to worry about now - such as assault charges.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1 p.m.

@JAP, No rational person would ever condone this outcome of this event. However, we should ask what initiated the whole mess. Trying to run up the score by throwing a long pass when the game outcome was over is really what started this. The rules do not ever say you have to take a knee to run out the clock, but sportsmanship should be common sense to head coaches. Test should really look in the mirror on this one.

purple coach

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 10:51 p.m.

i guess some people dont know how small of a percentage the budget is for sports also as a coach we teach much more than just sports also the kids have to keep up their grades to play i will also say that being a athletic director is a huge job and lots of work and im sure that both directors put in more hours than most of you that have made comments it was sad that this happened but this is not something that is encouraged and most of the kids work very hard to play on the teams and the coaches also put lots of hours in for little or in some cases no pay


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 7:49 p.m.

purple coach - It depends on how you count the numbers. Most than 50% of the cost of Skyline when into the athletic facilities, based on the proposal for an academic only vs a comprehensive high school. Roughly 30% of the bond money went into renovation or construction of new athletic facilities at other schools. Roughly $3 million a year in operating funds are sent to the athletic fund. Roughly $2 million a year in operating funds are spent to maintain athletics only fields. Roughly $5 to 12 million in booster money is spent on AAPS sports (this number has been secret for years and no one in the administration will respond to an FOIA for it - claiming privacy law violation). Small percentage? The $5 million in operations funds would have put 50 more teachers in the classrooms.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 9:35 a.m.

You really think that the superintendent is part of this process? I don't! I am sure she has her cabinet on it and will wait for a report. No need to get her hands dirty.


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:47 p.m.

I'm sure Ms Marigolis is thrilled a coach is posting on a public forum (if this is indeed a coach). When does the super's flight get in so the administration can get down to business?

Angry Moderate

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:33 p.m.

They are hiring an assistant coach for $5000.

Unusual Suspect

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:12 p.m.

AM, maybe assistant coaches. Just a guess.


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:12 p.m.

Sports are supposed to build character, develop good sportsmanship, and encourage academic success. When you have coaches yelling at each other and throwing punches, it's clear the athletic department is failing miserably at their mission.

Unusual Suspect

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:12 p.m.

The budget is so tight they can't even afford punctuation!

Angry Moderate

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 10:57 p.m.

Which coach gets no pay?

An Arborigine

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 9:54 p.m.

This event was more violent and farther reaching than reports. Many more injuries due to this foolishness, which cannot be tolerated in a tax payer-funded institution. Perhaps the AA high school football rivalry should be broadcast pay-per-view to raise funds to pay for this idiocy?

Flynn O'Donnell

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:42 p.m.

I'm sure the fight would get some money from pay-per-view!

say it plain

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 8:24 p.m.

I posted this on the thread about the injury to a Huron player, but I feel like it bears repeating, given that the AAPS spokesperson is highlighted here... Stop spending MILLIONS OF DOLLARS of AAPS TIGHT BUDGETS on Varsity Sports. Did having an athletic director for each of Pioneer *and* Huron help them with the ethics and sportsmanship of their programs? More so than at, say, school districts who get by with only *one* 100K/yr administrator per highschool sports system?! Let us educate our kids instead of getting them worked up over offensive plays on a field we spend too much money to maintain. Just enough. Spend the money on gym classes for fitness *and FUN* for more of our AAPS students. You might distinguish yourself from the other schools in the area and get more bodies in the buildings and make a couple bucks to boot, Dr. Green! The "student-athletes" can learn how to be adrenaline-controlled jerks in any of the 'ordinary' districts...lets truly live up to our marketing moniker of "ExtrAAordinary"!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 7:43 p.m.

EyeHeartA2 - In this budget year $3 million plus was transferred from the general fund to the athletic fund for varsity sports. In the last 12 months more than $11 million in bond funds and sinking fund money were spent on Varsity only facilities at the high schools. More than $2 million is spent for custodial and groundskeeping of varsity only outdoor fields. There is a rumored $5 to 12 million in booster money spent on varsity sports. Yes, millions, it is a big deal in Ann Arbor. The number, save the booster numbers, are all in the public record and filed with the state of Michigan.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 6:03 p.m.

This is a topic highjack. If you've got a beef about Varsity sports, why don't you post an opinion piece?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:22 p.m.

Like I said... supported...not covered... However if you did the math you have an average of 200 football players per school Freshmen, JV, Varsity paying at least $250 to play. That's $50k in funding. Head coaches make roughly $6k for the year and assistants make roughly $3k. Most staffs are only alloted 3 paid assistants and the rest are volunteers.. That equals $45k a year spent on coaches. MOST of these coaches spend upwards to 40hrs a week at 7 days. To add most of them use their salaries to give back to their programs. Football for most of these kids is a way to a better education...but of course you wouldn't know the value of that because you've probably never played the game or coached.

say it plain

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 4:11 p.m.

Wow, amazing to me the vitriol at the suggestion that maybe the money we spend on football, which is *not* covered only by pay to play, be better spent on other things given the tight budgets we are experiencing. Is my grammar truly lacking, fellow citizens, lol? Sorry for the all caps, but, you know, I am commenting on an all-caps kind of situation coming from out school system. Melee kind of situation. I guess the folks who are all "no big deal" about this kind of thing are okay with yelling pushing shouting from both players *and* the adults who are allegedly conveying sportsmanship and citizenship lessons via the Varsity Sports programs we spend millions on every year in this district. Unless someone can get the AAPS to show all the spending on these programs that they hide, in addition to the sizeable amounts they deign to show us, then I'm not buying the "get a clue" admonishments hurled my way either, just to say!


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 2:37 p.m.

So were you aware that AAPS is a pay to play system and the coaches salaries are supported by that funding?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:15 p.m.

Education does not take place soley in the classroom. Sports are a valuable learning experience, as are other extracurricular activities. Obviously AAPS has made poor hiring decisions at both schools in regards to the football staffs. There is an opportunity here to teach these kids - such as there are consequnces for their actions and just because some bonehead in a leadership position does something stupid doesn't mean that you should follow and act stupid .


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 12:59 p.m.

This post was not persuasive the first time it was posted. Shall we turn it into a serial?

Admiral Halsey

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 7:02 a.m.

Maybe grammar and sensational all-caps aren't your strong points. Athletics are a very important part of many young persons' lives and I think funding should be ample. Competitive, athletic activities encourage confidence, leadership, and heaps of other great characteristics.

Linda Peck

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 3:01 a.m.

Yes, I agree. Sports such as this do not and never have encouraged sportsmanship. There is no purpose at all except to release some wild and possibly violent behavior. Our schools have better issues to address.


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 8:02 p.m.

Any coaches involved should be fired immediately and students involved expelled. There's no excuse for this.


Mon, Oct 15, 2012 : 1:40 p.m.

I disagree with the extremism of your call. I think any involved coaches should be put on unpaid administrative leave for a good, long time (1 year) and both teams should not play organized sports for one year, as well.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:37 p.m.

This is now in the local, state, regional, and national spotlight. Are we going to have a high tolerance of violence in our public schools, avoid criminal prosecution for everyone involved, and try to cover this up? How bad would it look for AAPS, MHAA, our local and state legal system, and our image in the national spotlight?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:32 p.m.

AAPS and MHAA can provide consequences, but our public schools should not be immune to criminal prosecution. We would be teaching a bad lesson to say that we only have zero tolerance for domestic violence, but we permit this with our athletes, staff, and coaches. This is now in the local, state, regional, and national spotlight. Are we going to have a high tolerance of violence in our public schools, avoid criminal prosecution for everyone involved, and try to cover this up? How bad would it look for AAPS, MHAA, our local and state legal system, and our image in the national spotlight?


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 5:17 p.m.

1) Ignoring bad behavior because it might effect their chances for college football....could be part of the reason we have college football players in trouble with the law. 2) Some of the tweets by players don't make it sound like they were just "trying to break it up" loose lips sink ships, etc...

Flynn O'Donnell

Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 1:40 p.m.

Expelling students will only make matters worse. That will lead to more criminal activity in which you would probably also complain about. Some of these kids have chances to go to college for football. This was a small fight. Most people involved were laughing about it after. Would you like to ruin kids lives just because they got into a little brawl? I think not. Coaches I can understand. Except for the fact most of them were trying to BREAK IT UP. I think you should actually witness the fight before you make conclusions.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 11:10 a.m.

Needs to start with the AD's for hiring and pampering these dipsticks. The AD's are clueless. That's why something like this happens with their football teams. The kids need AD's who are mature role models.


Sun, Oct 14, 2012 : 2:58 a.m.

Yeah, great result. No tolerance policy and it won't happen again.


Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 11:35 p.m.

No, just teach them all respect and good sportsmanship. Both schools need to look at themselves in the mirror and say they are not like this, then go out there shake hands and maybe hold a community car wash together. Hopefully, when these two shcools play in other varsity sports the rest of the school year, they go out of their way to show respect.

mike gatti

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 8:42 p.m.

yes it would be a good result

Flynn O'Donnell

Sat, Oct 13, 2012 : 8:16 p.m.

Will that really be a good end result?